FORKNI-L
FORKNI-L Digest - 16 Jan 2005 to 17 Jan 2005 (#2005-17)
Mon, 17 Jan 2005
There are 29 messages totalling 869 lines in this issue.
Topics of the day:
1. Writing in English (12)
2. a weird fk moment (3)
3. Episode Thirteen
4. FK story
5. published authors <g> (3)
6. Need More Info Please!
7. A LaCroix moment...
8. English Writing Q Thingy
9. English Writing Q Thingy--Dialect
10. Admin: Staying on topic
11. Admin: Quote limit --READ
12. Published Fan Fiction--Re: published authors <g> (2)
13. Admin: Are we being watched?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Mon, 17 Jan 2005 01:15:49 +0000
From: Tracy Gooding <t.gooding@u.......>
Subject: Re: Writing in English
Quoting Kristen Fife <fenix23fyre@y.......>:
<<For example, Americans and Canadians tend to use a lot of
contractions in dialogue <snip> The most common are: I'm (for I am), s/he's
(s/he is), they're (they are) I've, they've, you've (I have, they have, you
have <snip>), you're (for you are), and can't (for cannot).>>
In England, native English speakers use a lot of contractions as well. All
the ones given above are absolutely in common use - my Dad's in his seventies
and has always used them, so I assume that they've been around for a while.
Phrases like 'in the same ballpark' or 'ballpark figures' are commonly used in
business and 'taking the fifth' is used (fairly jokingly) if someone doesn't
want to talk about a certain subject - thank you North American TV.
The one word I do not hear (contraction not used for emphasis) is 'gotten' -
we use 'got' instead. Also, 'purchase' (grip) is very rarely used by anyone
under about 60. Be careful about using idiomatic English when emphasising
someone's 'Englishness' because there is no such thing as a 'British'
accent. :)
Thanks to the people who confirmed that the season 2 DVDs are fine on multi-
region players.
Tracy G
t.gooding@u.......
-------------------------------------------
Too late at night for a sig.
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 16 Jan 2005 19:21:43 -0700
From: Micki <Mickilyn@i.......>
Subject: a weird fk moment
Hi guys...
I saw a guy in the mall I work at a couple of days ago who looked like LC in
what some call his "Q-tip head" phase... Except shorter, as this guy was no
taller than me, at most, and I'm 5'6".
What was really odd, given that because of his face I kept thinking LC, was
that this guy was wearing a woman's high-fashion evening gown (out of place
on even a woman in that shopping mall), and was wearing really high heeled
ladies shoes.
I live in a city that has a high number of individuals with unique (at the
very least) dressing styles. It wasn't the fact of him being dressed in
obvious women's wear that made it weird. (There is a surprising number of
those around here, for a redneck city.) It was just seeing LC in women's
evening wear that was so weird, until I did that mental double take &
realized it was just a look alike. Red Sequins would not suit LC!!!! Trust
me!
Back to lurking.
HUGS!!
-Micki
- - - - - - - -
Can't eat... beef (mad cow)... poultry or eggs (bird flu)...
pork (fear of bird flu infecting piggies)... fish (heavy metals in the
water)...
fruit & veggies (insecticides & herbicides)... guess that leaves CHOCOLATE.
- - - - - - - -
"There is no snooze button on a cat who wants breakfast." - unknown.
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 16 Jan 2005 20:19:38 -0600
From: Nancy Kaminski <nancykam@c.......>
Subject: Re: Writing in English
> Karen Reincke wrote:
> As an example, I am writing a story that is set in sort of
> Tudor times. I cannot use contractions for they did not use
> contractions for their speech. However, to use thee and thy
> would be very difficult for the modern reader (think of the
Hmm, I don't personally think that "thee" and "thou" language is
difficult to comprehend, but that's me. An excellent example of it
done well is our own FK novelization, "These Our Revels"---I thought
the period English was done well, just enough to give it flavor and a
great sense of the era.
> say they are speaking in that accent. After all, having
> Janette and Nick speak an entire story in French would not be
> very useful to English readers. But having the author say
> that they are speaking in French is something else entirely.
I agree, that's all you can do with foreign language if you're writing
for an English-speaking audience. I've read British novels of the
early 1900s in which vast stretches of dialog are written in French,
on the assumption that any educated person would know that language.
Unfortunately, I don't, and if there aren't any footnotes with the
translation I'm out of luck.
> I agree that you have to be careful with slang as well.
You have to careful with slang in non-fiction and technical writing.
For fiction is adds a lot of color and verisimilitude. Often you can
grasp the meaning by context. This is another tool in the writing
toolchest that needs to be used carefully, but it really should be
used when appropriate.
> Cars for instance in England have a bonnet where our hood is
> and they eat biscuits instead of cookies. If you would say
> someone enjoyed biscuits and gravy for breakfast, someone
> English would probaly look sideways at you.
BUT--if I were writing a story set in England I wouldn't have the
detective find a body in the trunk--it'd be a body in the boot. They'd
eat biscuits and take the lift and go to cricket or football matches
and wear jumpers, not sweaters. If you use American English terms for
all these things it sounds wrong. You have to trust your readers to
figure out things from the context or by looking the words up. If the
detective points to the rear of the car and says, "Open the boot,
please," I would hope that the reader would figure out they were
opening the trunk.
> If you wish to truly write for a multi-national audience,
> have a beta reader or someone who writes and knows the
> language read it for you.
I think this is just a bit backwards. Write the story to be true to
the characters, and if the audience is multinational, the non-English
speakers will have to learn to read colloquial language to enjoy the
story completely.
The area of writing where you absolutely must consider your reading
audience, and where comprehension is enormously important, is
technical writing. Consider what would happen if the instructions for
using a tool were written in language that people with limited or
formal English would not understand them? In the worst case, someone
could die. Elegance and style aren't necessary: clarity and simplicity
is.
Nancy Kaminski
who was recently directed to remove the word "may" from all
documentation because it is too vague for the translators to translate
correctly
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 16 Jan 2005 23:19:56 -0500
From: Greer Watson <gwatson2@r.......>
Subject: Episode Thirteen
Episode Thirteen is now linked in. Also, there are a whole group of
new pix up on the Notes page for Episode Seven, from "A Fate Worse
Than Death" (thanks to Nancy Taylor). A few more are scattered over
other pages.
For those who haven't been reading Season Four yet, the url is
http://ca.geocities.com/gwatson2@rogers.com/index.html. You access
the episodes off the Episode Guide. Each has its own homepage, from
which you download the zip file. Your choice of Word or WordPerfect.
Each episode also has a Notes page, which you click onto from the
homepage. But -- spoiler warning! -- don't read the Notes until after
you've read the episode.
Greer
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 17 Jan 2005 05:34:46 +0100
From: CousinLucilla <cousinlucilla@f.......>
Subject: Re: Writing in English
Tracy Gooding schrieb:
>
>The one word I do not hear (contraction not used for emphasis) is 'gotten' -
>we use 'got' instead.
>
That is a remnant of the old form which survived in America, but not in
Britain. But you do say "forgotten" or "misbegotten". Same root.
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 16 Jan 2005 10:14:49 -0500
From: Cheryl P <fknight420@c.......>
Subject: FK story
Any comments, so far, on the story? Thanks and stay safe.
Cheryl / fknight420@c.......
Sense what you have,
Don't trade a treasure
for an empty box.
ForeverKnight.5u.com.
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 15 Jan 2005 18:02:13 -0500
From: Cheryl P <fknight420@c.......>
Subject: Re: published authors <g>
Soul of redemption gets released in March, my first FK story.
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 17 Jan 2005 00:41:29 -0500
From: Greer Watson <gwatson2@r.......>
Subject: Re: Writing in English
Kristen says:
"For example, Americans and Canadians tend to use a lot of
contractions in dialogue. [...] We're a lazy bunch in N America ;)"
Not really. Many "function words" (modals, prepositions,
conjunctions, pronouns) in English have always had both full and
reduced forms, right back to medieval times. As a general rule of
thumb, the reduced form is the one that is used in speech when the
word is not stressed. These are *not* sloppy speech. They have a
history, just as much as the full forms have. It's just that they
don't teach this in school!
Before spelling was standardized, these forms sometimes appeared
in writing; but written English was usually stylistically formal and
did not use contractions. Hence Karen saying, " I am writing a story
that is set in sort of Tudor times. I cannot use contractions for
they did not use contractions for their speech." Actually, they did,
if you're talking about spoken English; but they didn't *write* them.
Today, there's a sort of sliding scale of use.
(1) in formal and academic writing, no contractions (which drives
undergraduates buggy, since they get -- or should get -- corrected by
any professor who is concerned with training them to write in proper
academic form);
(2) in popular non-fiction and the narrative part of fiction,
variation according to the author's style;
(3) in dialogue, naturalism (which means contractions for most
people).
Also, Cousin Lucilla says:
"I have read a lot of fan fiction, including this fandom, written by
natives that made me literally cringe in pain, because no one seems to
have taught them about spelling or grammar. Therefore: a good beta
reader is a thing to be treasured."
No flames from me. I've had exactly the same experience. I'm not
talking about typos: that's something else, solvable with a
spellcheck. But there are a lot of stories with homophonic confusion.
It happens in even in stories that have been beta read. Of course, it
may be that the beta readers can't spell the words either; but I
suspect that a lot of people take the duties of a beta reader to be
somewhat different from those of a proofreader: checking on FK
references and plot glitches, rather than spelling and punctuation.
Trouble is -- I get stopped cold when I read things like:
"Nick reigned in his blood lust."
"Nick stroked the dragon on his mantle.'
"Nick was phased by LaCroix's reaction."
Mmmm. Maybe I should expand a bit.
"In his blood lust, Nick ruled."
"Nick stroked the dragon on his cloak."
"LaCroix's reaction caused Nick to take on an immaterial aspect."
(An attempt to rephrase an SF verb, since standard English doesn't
have "phase" as a verb.)
Ouch.
Greer
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 17 Jan 2005 00:52:18 -0500
From: Greer Watson <gwatson2@r.......>
Subject: Re: Writing in English
Cousin Lucilla wrote:
"And regarding the 'accent thing': doing it wrong is worse than
not doing it at all."
To which Libratsie responded:
"That's true. And even in writing fanfic where you decide not to
write in dialect, you need to make the character real by using terms
of the intended area, or at least avoiding words not used in the
intended area."
Too true. It sticks out like a sore thumb to someone from that
intended area. There's an American healthy food supermarket
chain that just opened a store recently in downtown Toronto. They
seem to have just photocopied their American stores. There's an aisle
marked "Soda", for example. Local idiom would have the aisle marked
"Soft Drinks", though people would actually ask for "pop". And you
throw out discarded...uh, stuff... in a receptable that they've marked
"Trash". Local idiom would use the label, "Waste Disposal", and
people would toss their "garbage" there. If you want your business to
look like a foreign competitor, that's the way to go! (Actually, they
have some good stuff there.)
I suspect that many vampires don't bother to learn formally how idiom
varies as they move around. They drink the local language with their
dinner.
No wonder Nick slips up sometimes. It isn't the scriptwriters! It's
the cow's blood.
Greer
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 15 Jan 2005 06:17:52 -0500
From: Cheryl P <fknight420@c.......>
Subject: Re: Need More Info Please!
I don't have your e-mail off the list address, but Soul of Redemption
will be released in March, my first FK story. E-mail me off the list.
Stay safe.
Cheryl / fknight420@c.......
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 15 Jan 2005 02:57:04 -0500
From: Rose Warrington <misschaos@m.......>
Subject: Re: A LaCroix moment...
>
>I didn't realize LaCroix owned a trailer park.
>
-------------
Oh, my! I can see this leading to a fascinating and hilarious fanfic.
Rose
misschaos@m.......
Proud Vaquera, Knightie, and Cousin in one.
http://groups.msn.com/writingincircles- All writers WELCOME!!
>--Libs
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 17 Jan 2005 03:29:23 -0500
From: Cecilia Long <celong@m.......>
Subject: Re: Writing in English
Actually, being invovled in the SCA, I have learned that the use of Thee and
Thy is vastly overblown. It was more or less used as formal and in writing.
The average people really didn't go around saying theee and thy. And they
did use contractions in speech. I think more of it has to do with
writing... And what has been passed down is mostly the formal...
>As an example, I am writing a story that is set in sort of Tudor times. I
cannot use contractions for they did not use
>contractions for their speech. However, to use thee and thy would be very
difficult for the modern reader (think of the
> Bible--King James version). To do it well takes talent. See The Prince
and The Pauper by Mark Twain for an example of it
>very well done and able for the modern audience to read. I am not Mark
Twain.
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 17 Jan 2005 03:40:58 -0500
From: Cecilia Long <celong@m.......>
Subject: Re: Writing in English
The one I really really hate with a passion is when I see people using
PROLLY... As in... She is so good she will PROLLY win the prize...
ITS PROBABLY!!!!!!!!!!
And the linguists say that actually the true original British accent that we
would think of from Old English is from the backwoods of Red neck American
Appalachia.... That is where the accent has most been protected from
outside influence. To people who study lingusitics. Enlish in England is
not really original English. Rather fasinating actually.
>The one word I do not hear (contraction not used for emphasis) is 'gotten'
- we use 'got' instead. Also, 'purchase' (grip) is >very rarely used by
anyone under about 60. Be careful about using idiomatic English when
emphasising someone's 'Englishness'
>because there is no such thing as a 'British'accent. :)
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 17 Jan 2005 12:14:23 +0000
From: Luicia <luicia1705@y.......>
Subject: Re: Writing in English
Dialogue is an important factor for me if I am to
believe that such a character is from such a place....
its like actors performing with regional accents- it
makes it more plausible.
So in that sense, the dialogue of the character should
mirror the speaking patterns of where said character
is from and if such a place has a tendency to use
inflictions and the like then they should be used.
My .02 cent
Luicia
--- Kristen Fife <fenix23fyre@y.......> wrote:
I thought I'd see how many people, when writing
(and reading), believe dialogue is more believable
when using idiomatic tools. The most common are: I'm
(for I am), s/he's (s/he is), they're (they are)
I've, they've, you've (I have, they have, you
have-mostly for past tense as opposed to showing
possession), you're (for you are), and can't (for
cannot).
=====
If all the world's a stage....then where on earth's my script?!
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 17 Jan 2005 12:25:40 +0000
From: Luicia <luicia1705@y.......>
Subject: Re: Writing in English
--- CousinLucilla <cousinlucilla@f.......> wrote:
> And regarding the 'accent thing': doing it wrong is
> worse than not doing
> it at all.
>
Oh I completely agree with this... as a bearer of the
Irish brogue, the amount of times I have heard it
butchered in the name of drama...it makes me feel like
I'm watching a parody. There is nothing as off-putting
when the dying speech sounds like its from a scene
from Darby O'Gill
Excuse my rant...dodgy accents are my pet peeve.
=====
If all the world's a stage....then where on earth's my script?!
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 17 Jan 2005 07:52:52 -0500
From: Naia Zifu <naia_zifu@b.......>
Subject: English Writing Q Thingy
Spelling things the way people pronounce them in an attempt to write an
accent is going overboard, and can interfere with the enjoyment of a book.
I didn't like _To Kill a Mockingbird_ at first, because the dialect was hard
to understand. I also leave (modern) stories right away if they contain
"thee"s and "thou"s, because most modern people can't write that way without
seeming cheesy and fake. Much better just to suggest a language or dialect
by throwing in a word or expression native to the area, here and there. You
can also suggest personality with the right choice of words, such as fewer
contractions and more big words to suggest high intelligence, horrible
misuse of grammar to imply lower intelligence, rude language and cursing to
represent a hothead, etc. I try to do that, myself, though it's hard-- I
cringe if I have to type something like, "We was going to the store." :-P
> when writing (and reading), believe dialogue
> is more believable when using idiomatic tools. For
> example, Americans and Canadians tend to use a lot of
> contractions in dialogue
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 17 Jan 2005 14:35:39 +0000
From: Nancy Kaminski <nancykam@c.......>
Subject: Re: Writing in English
Greer Watson wrote:
> No flames from me. I've had exactly the same experience. I'm not
> talking about typos: that's something else, solvable with a
> spellcheck. But there are a lot of stories with homophonic confusion.
> It happens in even in stories that have been beta read.
There's an entire generation of US students who were told that spelling isn't
important, that it's more important to get thoughts down on paper. What'd they
call it? "Whole language" teaching. Bull hockey! I've beta's stories in which
I've done a full-blown copy edit only to have the author whimper and whine about
all the corrections, and that I "was only supposed to tell me how the story
was!" (To which I can only reply, don't ask someone who edits books for a living
to beta your story unless you're prepared for red ink <g>).
The bad spelling and grammar issue is always a huge thing for me. Unless the
story is amazingly good, I can't overlook basic errors and my delete key gets yet
another workout.
> Trouble is -- I get stopped cold when I read things like:
> "Nick reigned in his blood lust."
> "Nick stroked the dragon on his mantle.'
> "Nick was phased by LaCroix's reaction."
Oh, you really touched sore spots with those! Ow!
Nancy Kaminski
nancykam@c.......
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 17 Jan 2005 14:44:05 +0000
From: Nancy Kaminski <nancykam@c.......>
Subject: Re: Writing in English
Greer Watson wrote:
> Too true. It sticks out like a sore thumb to someone from that
> intended area. There's an American healthy food supermarket
> chain that just opened a store recently in downtown Toronto. They
> seem to have just photocopied their American stores.
On the other hand, sometimes marketing emphasizes the nationality of the
originating company. I own a Mini Cooper, and part of the charm of that very British
car is that British car terms are used---boot, bonnet, etc. You won't find a
Mini owner who doesn't call the back of their beloved little car the "boot", or
who doesn't talk about "bonnet stripes" referring to the optional racing stripes
you can purchase.
The company even sent me a brochure during the period I was waiting for my car
to arrive (it took 3 long, excruciating months!) to clue me in on proper
terminology in a very humorous way. (The "Unofificial Mini Owner's Manual" is a
hoot, covering such necessary information as how to make out in a Mini or where
to put your parking ramp ticket---you can download a copy, I believe, from either
www.miniusa.com or www.mini2.com, I forget which.)
I'm sure that there are other companies that do this sort of thing. It all
depends on how much you want to blend with the local culture, I guess.
Nancy Kaminski
nancykam@c.......
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 17 Jan 2005 15:03:58 +0000
From: Amy Hull <amilynh@c.......>
Subject: Re: English Writing Q Thingy--Dialect
TaraLJC wrote an excellent essay with very solid and effective examples in her
column at fanfiction.net: http://www.fanfiction.net/column.php?columnid=23
The focus of her essay is on writing Doyle from first season "Angel" and
writing for "Firefly, but it still addresses the ideas really well.
One of her main points is that we all (well, most; I certainly don't hear
things when I read terribly well) hear the characters' voices in our heads and that
the device of giving the reader a sense through the spelling of what something
sounds like, a la Mark Twain, has become unnecessary as recorded media has let
us all HEAR them ourselves.
Amy
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 17 Jan 2005 10:28:45 -0500
From: Lisa McDavid <mclisa@m.......>
Subject: Admin: Staying on topic
Guys, please remember, Forkni-i is for the discussion of Forever Knight. This
includes fannish activities and, yes, Forever Knight fanfic. We now have a
prayer: topic (yes, it's still under refinement but it's still there) for asking
for prayer and other moral support.
Posts to Forkni-l, unless they're under the prayer: topic, need a substantial
tie-in to Forever Knight. The current discussion about writing in English needs
it too. Some posters have done and are doing that, for which I thank them.
Some others lack the connection.
Please stay on topic. If you're not sure whether something is on topic for
Forkni-l, check with me (mclisa@m.......) or Don (argent@c.......). We
also allow off-topic posts on rare occasions.
You _must_ ask, btw. I've seen posts go onlist with OT: in front of the subject
line. Apparently the writers think that makes it ok. Maybe other lists allow
this, but Forkni-l doesn't.
McLisa
listowner, Forkni-l@lists.psu.edu
mclisa@m.......
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 17 Jan 2005 10:35:30 -0500
From: Lisa McDavid <mclisa@m.......>
Subject: Admin: Quote limit --READ
Look, I know for a fact that the rules went out yesterday after I sent them. I
have both posts in my mail box.
SO WHY ARE SOME PEOPLE OFF-TOPIC AND OVERQUOTING?!!!!!! WHY ARE PEOPLE
CONDUCTING PRIVATE CONVERSATIONS ON LIST?!
Yes, I'm yelling. I'm not happy. Those rules are there to keep the list
running smoothly. They're the same for everyone.
If this list isn't following the rules better by tomorrow, violators will risk
being set to review.
McLisa, who has a really busy week coming up and doesn't need this additional
burden from listers who should know better
mclisa@m.......
listowner, Forkni-l
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 17 Jan 2005 10:20:13 -0500
From: Stephanie Kellerman <stequina@i.......>
Subject: Re: Writing in English
My pet peeve is using "loose" for "lose". That really grates on my nerves!
Nancy Kaminski wrote:
>The bad spelling and grammar issue is always a huge thing for me. Unless the
story is amazingly good, I can't overlook basic errors and my delete key gets
yet another workout
>
>
--
"GROWING OLDER IS MANDATORY, GROWING UP IS OPTIONAL." -- Rose
Steph
stequina@i.......
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 17 Jan 2005 10:54:48 -0500
From: Lisa McDavid <mclisa@m.......>
Subject: Re: a weird fk moment
Micki writes, in part,
>It was just seeing LC in women's
>evening wear that was so weird, until I did that mental double take &
>realized it was just a look alike. Red Sequins would not suit LC!!!! Trust
>me!
Ok, how about some fanfic based on this? The challenge would be keeping it
PG-13 so it wouldn't need an adult: topic. <g>
McLisa
mclisa@m.......
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 17 Jan 2005 11:01:53 EST
From: Libratsie@a.......
Subject: Re: published authors <g>
In a message dated 1/17/05 12:42:18 AM Central Standard Time,
fknight420@c....... writes:
>
> Soul of redemption gets released in March, my first FK story.
I'm curious, and I'm sure others are as well so I'm asking on list - is this
a professionally published story? If so, I haven't heard that there were more
coming out.
If it is fan fiction being done in hard copy print format, you need to be very
careful to specify that as another writer on this list received a cease and
desist order for doing so. If it is fan fiction, you need to state it is fan
fiction in hard copy format to avoid any problems. ;-) This goes for anyone.
In either case, congratulations!
--Libs
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 17 Jan 2005 11:20:14 -0500
From: Deborah Hymon <debh@e.......>
Subject: Published Fan Fiction--Re: published authors <g>
So true Libs, it's a shady area. All fan fiction is a copyright violation.
There are articles on the internet about the legality of writing it. Type
in: History of Fan Fiction in a Google Search, and you'll have more than
enough reading material.
Last year when I sold the Forever Knight fanzine, Season of Change, I had
the back cover stating it was a Fan-Fiction story, and was produced for the
purpose of sharing the story and not for profit. I also stated the
characters and Forever Knight were not my creation, but remained the
intellectual property of the original writers or their representative. I
sold the copies for publishing cost plus shipping--I made no profit.
Most big corporations, like Sony, allow the fan fiction, realizing it has
the potential to bring more fans into the fandom, therefore making their
product sales increase. I know personally, through my fan fiction, I've
brought people into the fandom who never heard of FK before reading my
stories. Now they're buying the DVDs.
The problem occurs when people try to pass off the fan fiction as original
works, and MAKING A PROFIT! This gray area between fan fiction writer and
creator or owner has been going on for years, since the first written story
for Star Trek was published in 1967. Selling it in stores or for any
profit, and in my opinion even for a charity (because that's a profit), is
very risky, and I too would suggest--DON'T GO THERE!
Deborah
> If it is fan fiction being done in hard copy print format, you need to be
> very careful to specify that as another writer on this list received a cease
> and desist order for doing so. If it is fan fiction, you need to state it is
fan fiction in hard copy format to avoid any problems. ;-) This goes for
anyone.
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 17 Jan 2005 11:38:49 -0500
From: Lisa McDavid <mclisa@m.......>
Subject: Admin: Are we being watched?
It's possible and even probable. Last time we had messages on list about an FK
novel which was being published in a professional-quality book, the author got
a cease and desist order from Sony. There were other places Sony could have
heard about the book, but this list was the most active. The book in question
was also intended as a charitable venture.
We used to have at least one subscriber@s........ We also could have one
concealed, or one from an address which isn't identifiable. If so, there could be
legal trouble for Pennsylvania State University (PSU), Don and me if Sony
decides to stand on the letter of the law.
Sony has never taken notice of Fkfic-l or, to my knowledge, fanzines. Let's
keep it that way.
So, I'm going to have to ask that any discussion of any professionally
published FK story, other than the three books which Berkeley published under
license from Sony several years ago, not be sent to Forkni-l.
Thanks!
McLisa
listowner and therefore required to be a worrier, Forkni-l and Fkfic-l
mclisa@m.......
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 17 Jan 2005 10:01:14 -0800
From: Sherri Horun <sherrihorun@y.......>
Subject: Re: published authors <g>
Congrats Cheryl, I didn't know this. :) Sherrilynn
Cheryl P <fknight420@c.......> wrote:Soul of redemption gets released in
March, my first FK story.
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Date: Mon, 17 Jan 2005 19:03:20 +0000
From: Nancy Kaminski <nancykam@c.......>
Subject: Re: Published Fan Fiction--Re: published authors <g>
Deborah Hymon wrote:
> creator or owner has been going on for years, since the first written story
> for Star Trek was published in 1967. Selling it in stores or for any
> profit, and in my opinion even for a charity (because that's a profit), is
> very risky, and I too would suggest--DON'T GO THERE!
Publishing fanzines for charity is a tried-and-true means of a) doing good
works, and b) getting fanfic out in print. There have been any number of charity
fanzines (including the two I've published) that have benefited the charities
favored by various FK actors. One of the zines I published (with much assistance
from other fans) was "A Taste of Forever" ----we were able to send over $2500 to
Childrens' Hospital.
<shameless plug> "A Taste of Forever" is still available for purchase in PDF
format on CD. Email me for details. </shamesless plug>
The one instance where Sony stomped on a fanfic writer'd project (Jean Graham's
"On Holy Ground") the book actually looked like a trade paperback, and had
pretty high production values. Sony apparently felt it was encroaching too closely
on the published FK novels (despite it being a charity effort) and stopped it.
Most zines are frankly amateur productions and are clearly not professional
printing jobs, and if they're clearly labeled as non-profit and/or charity
projects and include the copyright disclaimers they most likely will be ignored
as "mostly harmless".
Nancy Kaminski
nancykam@c.......
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Date: Mon, 17 Jan 2005 12:56:33 -0800
From: Shana Bennett <wldthngwthfngs@h........>
Subject: Re: a weird fk moment
Oh my... the image that conjures! ::shudders::
Shana Bennett
Valentine... and I'm not changing it, KC!
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End of FORKNI-L Digest - 16 Jan 2005 to 17 Jan 2005 (#2005-17)
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