FORKNI-L
Digest - 7 Mar 2008 to 8 Mar 2008 (#2008-64)
Sat, 8 Mar 2008
There are 9 messages totalling 262 lines in this issue.
Topics of the day:
1. Enforcers, Carouche, and the Nature of Blood (2)
2. New? Amsterdam, its relation to Nick, and the use of historical flashbacks
(3)
3. the nature of enforcer vampires
4. immortals who do tend to stay put (2)
5. Trip to Britain - Attention all FK, Ger, Doctor Who, David Tennant fans
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Date: Fri, 7 Mar 2008 21:53:03 -0800
From: Nancy Kaminski <nancykam@c.......>
Subject: Re: Enforcers, Carouche, and the Nature of Blood
-----Original Message-----
Walt wrote:
> It would seem that part of a vampires power
> lies in his age: the older he is the stronger he is.
That seems to be canon. Another element of why Screed backs down, I think,
is that Nick, LC, and Screed are products of a very stratified society, and
that Nick and LC were at the top of society (a minor Norman noble and a
Roman patrician), and Screed is definitely a commoner of the lowest sort.
You often see Nick and LC acting like they own the world---they assume
they're in charge.
> I don't think LaCroix would hesitate to take out
> an enforcer if he thought he could get away with
> it, but I'm sure he knows that if two of them
> disappeared while going to see him, that others
> would be following to find out what happened.
It's never mentioned, but there must be some sort of authority that recruits
(or creates) them and directs their activities. It might be a Very Bad Thing
to mess with that authority's minions, so bad that even LC thinks twice
about it.
> It would also appear that they are chosen
> for their muscle and not their mental prowess.
They have extra-large fangs, too. I remember there was a fanfic that posited
that if a regular vampire gets out of line and incurs the wrath of the vamp
PTB, he/she is turned into an Enforcer---big, strong, mega-fanged, and
almost zombie-like. Truly a fate worse than undeath!
Nancy Kaminski
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Date: Fri, 7 Mar 2008 22:01:27 -0800
From: Nancy Kaminski <nancykam@c.......>
Subject: Re: New? Amsterdam, its relation to Nick, and the use of historical
flashbacks
Walt wrote:
> John Amsterdam is a "homicide detective" (sound familiar?) who is also
> immortal (again, sound familiar?), But, the gimick here is that he
> can't leave the island of Manhattan.
I think they might have dropped that premise, because on last night's show
in a flashback he joined the army during WWII. I don't think he would have
stationed in Manhattan for the duration, so unless they're going to follow
the FK Book of Series Continuity, that gimmick is a bust.
Nancy Kaminski
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 8 Mar 2008 00:37:53 -0500
From: Jean Graham <jeang477@a.......>
Subject: New? Amsterdam, its relation to Nick, and the use of historical
flashbacks
Walt wrote:
> John Amsterdam is a "homicide detective" (sound familiar?)
> who is also immortal (again, sound familiar?),
> But, the gimick here is that he can't leave the island of Manhattan.
Actually, that's the gimmick in Pete Hamill's bestselling novel "Forever,"
which has a similar (but not similar enough to be actionable, apparently) theme.
The gimmick in "New Amsterdam" is that the hero can't stop being immortal until
he finds his "one true love." Whoever wrote the promo literature must have been
confusing the two.
The series more closely resembles "Highlander" than "Forever Knight" in that
Amsterdam isn't a vampire, just a lonely, brooding immortal guy who's had to
watch his wives, lovers and children grow old and die over four centuries while he
remains young. The first two episodes weren't at all bad, IMO. But of course,
in a stroke of pure but typical genius, FOX had already decided the series was
toast before they ever aired it. There are 6 (possibly 8) episodes and no more
in production or planned. This is because A) It's an intelligently-written
series with empathetic characters, and B) I like it, which is a sure-fire curse that
automatically dooms any new show right out of the gate.
["Moonlight," which so closely cribs from FK that I frankly don't believe the
producers' claims that they never heard of Nick and Co., is also in limbo, due
to the writers' strike, and has about a 30% chance of making it back into
production, depending on who's doing the predicting.]
Unlike Nick, John Amsterdam doesn't seem too concerned about keeping his
immortality a secret. But then, he doesn't have to cover up multiple murders, explain
bottles of blood in his fridge, or concoct bizarre allergies to justify not
being able to work the day shift. :-)
"New Amsterdam's" flashbacks (and rock video sequences!) *are* very reminiscent
of FK, right down to the glaring historical inaccuracies. Right off the bat,
they got the Native Americans wrong. The CGI time progression sequence from 1650
to present day NY is great, but the New England tribes didn't build teepees -
they lived in hogans, longhouses and wigwams made of wood. Oh well, I guess if
Nick can remember the Battle of Hastings, which occurred a century before his
mortal birth, then John Amsterdam can canoodle with Lakota plains Indians in
17th Century Manhattan. (!)
I'd have loved to see FK do more flashbacks to Nick's Crusade years, too, btw.
But as Walt says, that would have made including LaCroix and Janette pretty
darn difficult. Still, I've always wished they'd found a way to do a flashback to
the events alluded to in "Last Act," where Nick was wounded in battle outside
the Moorish castle and apparently captured. Guess we'll just have to be happy
with fanfic on that count.
Planning to enjoy "New Amsterdam" while I can...
--Jean G.
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 8 Mar 2008 02:23:47 EST
From: Gaelin Wade <GaelinWade@a.......>
Subject: Re: New? Amsterdam, its relation to Nick, and the use of historical
flashbacks
I'm not sure this was ever supposed to be part of the series. There was
speculation that the series was based on a book (ripped off according to its
author) where the hero was unable to leave Manhattan. I'm not sure it was
supposed to be a plot point of the series.
However, as someone earlier pointed out, the series is more like Highlander
(in its immortality angle) than Forever Knight.
Gaelin
Walt wrote:
the gimick here is that he can't leave the island of Manhattan.
nancykam@c....... writes:
I think they might have dropped that premise...unless they're going to
follow the FK Book of Series Continuity, that gimmick is a bust.
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 8 Mar 2008 06:05:03 -0500
From: Emily Lacey <laceyem@h.......>
Subject: Re: Enforcers, Carouche, and the Nature of Blood
> > In Unreality TV, they do seem to act differently from
> > normal vampires, though. The oh-so-menacing but
> > extremely easy to escape pace they walk at, their lack
> > of conversational abilities,
>
> It would also appear that they are chosen
> for their muscle and not their mental prowess.
>
> Or, then again, maybe they're just cranky. ;->
Makes one wonder about the existence of women Enforcers... I dread to think
of eternal PMS.
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 8 Mar 2008 08:53:42 -0600
From: "Stone, Barbara" <STONEB@g.......>
Subject: the nature of enforcer vampires
Any discussion of the nature of enforcer vampires must account for the
extraordinary size of their fangs.
Do they have long fangs because they are a different species of vampire? Or is
the length of their fangs
due to a sort of natural selection process: vampire fangs come in different
lengths, but longer-fanged
vamps tend to get the job of enforcer because the longer fangs make them better
for the job. Or is there
some substance (similar to steroids) that a vampire can consume that will, over
time, lengthen the fangs?
Calcium? Sodium fluoride? Snake blood? Or perhaps they are the ones who
spent there early vampire years
feeding on dentists?
B. Stone
stoneb@g.......
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 8 Mar 2008 09:03:06 -0600
From: "Stone, Barbara" <STONEB@g.......>
Subject: immortals who do tend to stay put
Nick didn't dare let his secret out because the enforcers would put an end to
him and to any hapless mortal who held the
secret. I'm not sure about Mick (but then I haven't seen all of every ep of
_Moonlight_). But it seems to me that the
very worst that could happen to Amsterdam if his secret were to become widely
known, would be the inconvenience of celebrity
and a bunch of scientists knocking on his door in search of a lab rat. Mostly,
people just don't believe him, so he can
afford to make anachronistic wisecracks all day, to the delight of the viewers
and the mystification of the rest of the
characters. And so it doesn't matter that he can't move off the island, as
long as he can solve his cases from there.
B. Stone
stoneb@g.......
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 8 Mar 2008 09:06:39 -0800
From: cindy clark <badwolf15895@s.......>
Subject: Re: immortals who do tend to stay put
What if John Amsterdam were to run into another immortal? Wouldn't one of his
anchronistic wisecracks make Nick or LaCroix do a double-take?
Most people have minds like concrete: mixed up or permanently set.
----- Original Message ----
From: "Stone, Barbara" <STONEB@g.......>
To: FORKNI-L@l.......
Sent: Saturday, March 8, 2008 10:03:06 AM
Subject: immortals who do tend to stay put
Mostly, people just don't believe him, so he can afford to make anachronistic
wisecracks all day, to the delight of the viewers and the mystification of the
rest of the characters.
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 8 Mar 2008 10:47:40 -0800
From: Knight Ranger <knightranger1228@y.......>
Subject: Trip to Britain - Attention all FK, Ger, Doctor Who, David Tennant
fans
Sorry for the cross-posting but I trying to reach as many people as possible.
I'm planning a trip to Britain this summer and would love to meet with any
Forever Knight, Geraint Wyn Davies, Doctor Who, and/or David Tennant fans who live
there. We could meet for coffee, lunch, or dinner just to talk about our
mutual interests.
I will be in Britain from August 18 to September 18, and will be renting a car
and travelling all over. The main cities right now are Edinburgh, Glasgow,
Blackpool, Liverpool, Stratford-upon-Avon, Cardiff, and London. I will also be
going to the Isle of Man. Possible additions may be Bristol and York.
The main purpose of my trip is to see David Tennant starring as Hamlet at the
Royal Shakespeare Company in Stratford-upon-Avon. I also have a ticket for the
Edinburgh Tattoo. I'm looking forward to the Doctor Who Museum in Blackpool
and the Exhibitions in Cardiff and London.
I'd love to meet any Whovians and Knighties along the way. A special shout-out
to anyone who attended the Weekend Without Ger in Swindon in 1998.
Please contact me off-list and I can give you more details.
Thanks.
Debbie Grace
Knight Ranger
e-mail: KnightRanger1228@y....... - or - KnightRanger4ver@y.......
Geraint Wyn Davies Fan for Life! (GWDFC/GWDN)
Dark Knightie/Nick & Nat Packer/Caddy Whack/FOREVER KNIGHT Die Hard
BLACK HARBOUR Lobster Yacht Lot/Harbour Light ** -- GAIRWOLFpack -- **
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End of FORKNI-L Digest - 7 Mar 2008 to 8 Mar 2008 (#2008-64)
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