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FORKNI-L Digest - 8 Dec 2004 to 9 Dec 2004 (#2004-340)

Thu, 9 Dec 2004

There are 18 messages totalling 528 lines in this issue.

Topics of the day:

  1. FK ALUMNI - LIVE Alert for DECEMBER
  2. What Do You Get A Vampire for Christmas...
  3. HELP!!! Catholic question (15)
  4. Yuletide Awards Deadline Extended

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Date:    Wed, 8 Dec 2004 15:11:41 -0800
From:    Adina Montgomery <adinaruth@e.......>
Subject: Re: FK ALUMNI - LIVE Alert for DECEMBER

I couldn't connect via the url below, but did find the gallery at:
http://www.tnb.nb.ca/photogallery/

Regards,
Adina
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Now till December 2-th, Nigel Bennett and Stacy Smith are starring in a stage
production of Charles Dickens OTHER Christmas story  'Cricket on the Hearth'
which is touring New Brunswick. The schedule for times and towns can be found
at www.newbrunswicktheatre.ca.

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 9 Dec 2004 00:58:38 -0000
From:    Linda Hepden <kezia.hepden@n.......>
Subject: Re: What Do You Get A Vampire for Christmas...

> --- Linda Hepden <kezia.hepden@n.......> wrote:
>
>> Let's see, aside of what's already been mentioned...
>>
>> > Subscription to a Canadian police magazine
>>
>> An inflatable crocodile (whoops!  Sorry, wrong list!)
>
> What list is that from?
>
Hi, Viv!

Sorry - still way behind with my emails after the recent War.  Which is
where the list comes from - it's one of the items Bonnie, the Cousinly
Receptionist, and I end up selling on eekBay after Cousin Shelley goes mad
with LC's credit card.

Cousin Kezia

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 8 Dec 2004 23:45:47 -0500
From:    Deborah Hymon <debh@e.......>
Subject: HELP!!! Catholic question

I'm really uneducated in the Catholic religion, so I need help. I'm working
on a FK Christmas story.

Is there a term given when a Catholic makes the sign of the cross over their
chest?

Thanks,
Deb

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 8 Dec 2004 22:55:46 -0600
From:    Nancy Kaminski <nancykam@c.......>
Subject: Re: HELP!!! Catholic question

> Deborah Hymon wrote:

> Is there a term given when a Catholic makes the sign of the
> cross over their chest?

It's just called "making the sign of the cross." Usage:

--Nicolas made the sign of the cross.
--Nicolas crossed himself.

That's about it.

Nancy Kaminski
nancykam@c.......

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 8 Dec 2004 21:02:49 -0800
From:    Michele C <mobody_62@y......>
Subject: Re: HELP!!! Catholic question

When I was growing up, it was always called making the
sign of the cross.  I have never heard it called a
name.  That doesn't mean there isn't one tho.  You
might try a Google search for more info.
MO

--- Deborah Hymon <debh@e.......> wrote:

> Is there a term given when a Catholic makes the sign
> of the cross over their
> chest?

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 9 Dec 2004 00:16:24 -0500
From:    Emily Lacey <laceyem@b.......>
Subject: Re: HELP!!! Catholic question

>  > Is there a term given when a Catholic makes the sign of the
>  > cross over their chest?

Not being Catholic, are you thinking of when they get to the end of a
pew and kneel on one knee, look towards the crucifix at the front of
the church and make the sign of the cross? I believe that is called
'genuflecting'.
--
Emily Lacey
laceyem@b.......

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 8 Dec 2004 23:25:46 -0700
From:    Angela Gottfred <agottfre@t.......>
Subject: Re: HELP!!! Catholic question

In older usage, it can also be called "blessing oneself" ("the frightened
peasant blessed himself at the sight of the vampire"). It's no longer in common
usage. For more info, go to http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=bless .
Oh, and here's the Catholic Encyclopedia (1907) entry for "Cross, Sign of the":
http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/13785a.htm Note that the encyclopedia predates
the major reforms of Vatican II.

Your humble & obedient servant,
Angela Gottfred

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 9 Dec 2004 04:00:09 EST
From:    Angela Ulmen <Maelynd31@a.......>
Subject: Re: HELP!!! Catholic question

I've always heard it called 'genuflecting', by those I know who  practice
Catholocism.  Then again... those I know are fellow clergy, and we  usually end
up using words we remember from childhood.  Not sure about it;  I can ask if
you'd like.

Ang
NNPack Keeper of the Flame/War Correspondent; Proud  Vaquera
Survivor, wars 8, 9, 10, 11 & 12
"Don't say I'm out of touch  with this rampant chaos - your reality.  I know
well what lies beyond my  sleeping refuge - the nightmare I built my own world
to escape..." -  Evanescence, Imaginary

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 9 Dec 2004 04:10:00 EST
From:    KnghtWtch@a.......
Subject: Re: HELP!!! Catholic question

In a message dated 12/9/2004 4:01:31 A.M. Eastern Standard Time,
Maelynd31@a....... writes:

I've  always heard it called 'genuflecting', by those I know who   practice
Catholicism.  Then again... those I know are fellow clergy, and we  usually end
up using words we remember from childhood.   Not sure about it;  I can ask if
you'd  like.



The Sign of the Cross was and is used my Catholics to open or  bless a
beginning of a prayer.  It was taught back in the 50's to school  children as a
way to call attention to God that tells Him a person is calling  him.

Genuflecting is a sign or respect to the Blessed Sacrament [ A  Host blessed
at Mass by a priest and is representative of the Body of  Christ]
when the Holy Host is present on the Altar.  You would  know the Sacrament is
present by a lighted candle to the right of the  Altar.
You never pass thru the center of the Altar  Isle without  genuflecting.
Also we would genuflect just before we entered into a  pew.  Us old timer's
still observe these customs.

KnightWitch ;-]=
_www.ForeverKnight.US_ (http://www.ForeverKnight.US)

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 9 Dec 2004 08:08:11 -0500
From:    Stephanie Kellerman <stequina@i.......>
Subject: Re: HELP!!! Catholic question

Just making the sign of the cross is calling just that "making the sign
of the cross" or crossing himself as Nancy said.

The genuflecting others are mentioning is when you go to one knee and
bow in worship. This does not necessarily require making the sign of the
cross, but most people also do make the sign of the cross at the same time.

And yes I am a Catholic.

Deborah Hymon wrote:

>Is there a term given when a Catholic makes the sign of the cross over their
>chest?
>
>Thanks,
>Deb
>
>
>
"GROWING OLDER IS MANDATORY, GROWING UP IS OPTIONAL." -- Rose
Steph
stequina@i.......

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 9 Dec 2004 08:23:47 EST
From:    Billie Lee Williams <McCelt2003@a.......>
Subject: Re: HELP!!! Catholic question

In a message dated 12/9/2004 1:11:12 AM Pacific Standard Time,
KnghtWtch@a....... writes:
The Sign of the Cross was and is used my Catholics to open or  bless a
beginning of a prayer.
Momentary delurk, here.....

Making The Sign of the Cross (and yes, sorry, forget who, but that is all it
is called), is used to open and *close* many, many things, in the middle of
things, including at the beginning at the beginning of saying a Rosary, many
times during the saying of a Rosary, and, I cannot even tell you how many other
times, or during how many other prayers and activities.  It is indeed common
practice to make The Sign of the Cross while Genuflecting.  It is also
considered good form to make the Sign when accepting Holy Communion.  The list
truly does go on and on.

"Indulgences" are granted for each time one makes the Sign in true faith.
Except that the notion of Purgatory is not really embraced by the Modern
Catholic Church anymore.  It was not/is not my intention to give a lecture;
just
thought I would give a little more information, as it sounded like it might be
needed for a story or something (I have not read all my email).

I am still *technically* Catholic <g>, was a member of the Confraternity of
Christian Doctrine; translation = Catechism Instructor for both Elementary and
High School aged kids.  I was also an Assistant Teacher in a Private Catholic
school and an assistant to more than one Priest.  Soooooo, I learned a whole
lot about stuff like this.  Oh, and I was known as a "Catechetical Minister;"
suppose I still am, since that is something the Church doesn't take away.  Now
that I am Ordained in a, well, I guess it would be called Protestant since it
is not Catholic <grin> non-denominational Christian Church--most likely none
of the above applied anymore?

I do still have "The owner of this car is a Roman Catholic. In case of an
emergency, please call a priest," engraved on a pewter Crucifix hanging on the
rear view mirror hanging in my car.  When I am asked why, I say, "Old habits
die hard, and there is comfort in ritual."

Which I am sure is ___way more___ than you all wanted to know, LOL.

I don't know everything about Catholicism, especially since many things have
changed, but if I can help with anything else for an FK Fanfic story or
something, please feel free to ask.

Forever Yours,
Billie-Lee (who has lotsa' time just now <sigh>)
mccelt2003@a.......
"Oh, Master grant that I may never seek, so much to be consoled as to
console."
Saint Francis

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 9 Dec 2004 16:23:28 GMT
From:    KC Smith <tigrlady2u@j.......>
Subject: Yuletide Awards Deadline Extended

 Due to many requests, I'm extending the deadline for submissions to the
Yuletide Awards to Midnight Pacific Standard Time on December 24th, 2004. Winners
will be announced on December 31st.  For rules and guidelines, please see my site:
http://kc.descentintodarkness.net  Happy writing, and good luck!

KC Smith
tigrlady2u@j.......
Nick/Natpacker with dark tendencies.
"I've never met a chocolate I didn't like."


------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 9 Dec 2004 16:36:45 +0000
From:    Luicia <luicia1705@y.......>
Subject: Re: HELP!!! Catholic question

Genuflecting is what Catholics do in front of altars before sitting or passing
by it...it involves bending your right knee in reverence followed by blessing
yourself in acknowledgement of the presense of the Holy Trinity.... convent
school was good for something ;P

Angela Ulmen <Maelynd31@a.......> wrote:I've always heard it called
'genuflecting', by those I know who practice
Catholocism.



 If all the world's a stage....then where on earth's my script?!


------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 9 Dec 2004 12:39:03 -0500
From:    Emily Lacey <laceyem@b.......>
Subject: Re: HELP!!! Catholic question

>Genuflecting is a sign or respect to the Blessed Sacrament [ A  Host blessed
>at Mass by a priest and is representative of the Body of  Christ]
>when the Holy Host is present on the Altar.  You would  know the Sacrament is
>present by a lighted candle to the right of the  Altar.
>You never pass thru the center of the Altar  Isle without  genuflecting.
>Also we would genuflect just before we entered into a  pew.  Us old
>timer's still
>observe these customs.

Thank you. I had the basics, but you made a whole lot more sense of it.
I do have a question for you though...
Isn't the lighted candle always there as a sign of Christ's presence?
I thought the host was there only as part of a mass...
--
Emily Lacey
laceyem@b.......

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 9 Dec 2004 11:14:30 -0700
From:    Angela Gottfred <agottfre@t.......>
Subject: Re: HELP!!! Catholic question

WARNING: the following post probably contains TOO MUCH INFORMATION, even for
the Catholics on the list.

Catholics genuflect (a form of bowing involving the knees--like a curtsey, when
you think about it) when in the presence of the Blessed Sacrament (communion
wafers which have become the Body of Christ during the Mass). This is because
you are in the presence of Christ, and should show respect and reverence. In
most Catholic churches, the Blessed Sacrament is kept in a special box next to
the altar at the front of the church; this box is called the Tabernacle, and
its location is marked by a candle burning in a red container (the "sanctuary
light").

However, not all Catholic churches keep the Tabernacle containing the Blessed
Sacrament next to the altar; it is perfectly proper (in fact, encouraged since
Vatican II) to have a chapel within the church--so long as it has a prominent
place within the church--where the Tabernacle is kept instead. This allows
everyday activities (e.g. cleaning, weddings, etc.) to take place in the church
worship space without disturbing people who have come to the church to spent
time praying in the presence of the Blessed Sacrament. So, to find out when and
where you ought to be genuflecting in an unfamiliar church, look for the red
sanctuary lamp.

I'm sure that's clear as mud for most readers, but I had to get it out of my
system. Yes, my church has the chapel arrangement.

Your humble & obedient servant,
Angela Gottfred

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 9 Dec 2004 18:31:47 +0000
From:    Luicia <luicia1705@y.......>
Subject: Re: HELP!!! Catholic question

 --- Emily Lacey <laceyem@b.......> wrote:
> >Genuflecting is a sign or respect to the Blessed
> Sacrament [ A  Host blessed
> >at Mass by a priest and is representative of the
> Body of  Christ]
> >when the Holy Host is present on the Altar.  You
> would  know the Sacrament is
> >present by a lighted candle to the right of the
> Altar.
> >You never pass thru the center of the Altar  Isle
> without  genuflecting.
> >Also we would genuflect just before we entered into
> a  pew.  Us old
> >timer's still
> >observe these customs.
>
> Thank you. I had the basics, but you made a whole
> lot more sense of it.
> I do have a question for you though...
> Isn't the lighted candle always there as a sign of
> Christ's presence?
> I thought the host was there only as part of a
> mass...
> --
> Emily Lacey
> laceyem@b.......
>

=====

 If all the world's a stage....then where on earth's my script?!


------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 9 Dec 2004 18:33:42 +0000
From:    Luicia <luicia1705@y.......>
Subject: Re: HELP!!! Catholic question

 --- Emily Lacey <laceyem@b.......> wrote:

> Isn't the lighted candle always there as a sign of Christ's presence?
> I thought the host was there only as part of a mass...

In my church and others that I've attended, the
tabernacle candle is constantly lit  so....

=====

 If all the world's a stage....then where on earth's my script?!



------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 9 Dec 2004 14:37:58 EST
From:    KnghtWtch@a.......
Subject: Re: HELP!!! Catholic question

In a message dated 12/9/2004 12:39:26 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,
laceyem@b....... writes:

Thank  you. I had the basics, but you made a whole lot more sense of it.
I do have  a question for you though...
Isn't the lighted candle always there as a  sign of Christ's presence?
I thought the host was there only as part of a  mass...



Yes, it is a sign of Christ presence in the form of the Host  blessed at Mass.
The Host  that is blessed at any Mass can be used  for this purpose along
with the ceremony of Benediction  of the Host which  is a ceremony not like the
Mass but it's just a form of praise for Christ.   At Benediction a set form
of prayers said by the Priest and parishioners  while the Host is held inside
the Holy Monstrance .during the ceremony the  prayers are said and incense is
used in the direction of the Host.  The  changing of the bread/host and wine
into the Body and Blood of Christ not   performed.

If the candle/light is not lit, then the Christ/Host is not  present in the
Tabernacle of the Altar therefore you are not required to  genuflect.
Sorry I wasn't clear on that.
I spent 4 years in a Juniorate {high school for girls intent  on becoming
nuns}  and two years in the novitiate along with teaching 4  graders, like
Billie in the CCD, Confraternity of Christian  Doctrine.

Wow has this started some conversation.  'Give me back  that old time
religion' as they say.  Things have changed a lot in the  Church since the
teachings back in the 50's.

KnightWitch ;-]=

------------------------------

End of FORKNI-L Digest - 8 Dec 2004 to 9 Dec 2004 (#2004-340)
*************************************************************


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