FORKNI-L
FORKNI-L Digest - 19 Aug 2000 (#2000-260)
Sat, 19 Aug 2000
There are 16 messages totalling 479 lines in this issue.
Topics of the day:
1. Subject: Re: On Holy Ground out of print (3)
2. Sony
3. (Fwd) Re: Please don't write to Sony
4. YKYB...
5. On Holy Ground Out Of Print
6. fanfic
7. While we're penning down fans
8. <No subject given>
9. OT question
10. Us and TPTB and fanfic
11. Caligula, etc and Patrician boys
12. Blitzing for the Knight: August (2)
13. Need A Beta
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Date: Sat, 19 Aug 2000 08:59:06 +0200
From: Llarian <manulanger@t.......>
Subject: Re: Subject: Re: On Holy Ground out of print
From: Portia 1 <portia1@m.......>
>
> I know the Buffy fandom got hit hard and lost a goodly number of sites....
>
Which sites exactly? I only know about the transcripts, which were closed
at the request of the copyright holders. The fanfiction on the same site (!)
is still there.
Llarian
mailto:manulanger@t.......
http://www.llarian.de
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 19 Aug 2000 09:03:37 +0200
From: Llarian <manulanger@t.......>
Subject: Re: Sony
From: <BJDFKFan@a.......>
> Yeah, we should, but we don't. <G> The last time I tried the
> feedback@s....... addy it bounced,
Hmmmm..... maybe they closed it because of all the pesky requests
for more FK? Very much like kids covering their ears so they won't hear
what they don't want to hear?
Just kidding... or maybe not.
Llarian
mailto:manulanger@t.......
http://www.llarian.de
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 19 Aug 2000 03:12:13 +0600
From: Don Fasig <phase3@g.......>
Subject: (Fwd) Re: Please don't write to Sony
Forwareded on behalf of "Brenda" <bcammarata@h.......>
Don Fasig
Argent@e.......
------- Forwarded message follows -------
From: "Brenda" <bcammarata@h.......>
Funny, I always thought Max Headroom was LaCroix' alter-ego.
Think about it.
Carpe Noctem,
Brenda
-----Original Message-----
BrandyKitt@a....... said...
<(I love to see
>what Lacroix would think of Max!).
------- End of forwarded message -------
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 18 Aug 2000 18:42:58 CDT
From: You Want What? <marajade4780@h.......>
Subject: YKYB...
... thinking about Forever Knight too much when...
You're driving back home, and you hear the birthday and anniversary wish
list on your local radio station, and someone's twins are having a birthday.
Their names? Nick and Natalie!
:-)
Becky
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 19 Aug 2000 09:04:17 +0100
From: Mel <melody@r.......>
Subject: Re: Subject: Re: On Holy Ground out of print
From: Portia 1
>
> I know the Buffy fandom got hit hard and lost a goodly number of sites....
>
I can understand video and mp3's that have only just hit
the shops being closed down, But I'll never understand
the closing down of the fan sites which only serve to
keep the show alive! I have found the fan site encourage
you to spend money on legitimate merchandise, they are
usually the only way to find out what's available and where.
These companies are the bad vampires, draining the life
blood of all the creative ppl out there, I vote they should
be staked out in the sun:-) or are they demons enforcing
possesion of the Actor/resses souls, refusing to share
unless they get rich on it.
Mel (starting to get a rant on)
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 19 Aug 2000 11:00:40 +0200
From: Llarian <manulanger@t.......>
Subject: Re: On Holy Ground Out Of Print
From: Cecilia Long <celong@m.......>
> Almsot all of the X files sites were forcebly remvoed
Same question as for the Buffy sites: Which ones?
The GossamerProject is up and running, although they
changed addresses about 2 years or so ago.
Alarmed by you message, I just checked - and there
are dozens of XFiles sites on the web!
Yes, I went to Gossamer and randomly opened several
of the links to other fanfic sites there. Except for one,
they all worked fine - and that one worked the second time
around (Xoom`s usual problem).
Llarian
mailto:manulanger@t.......
http://www.llarian.de
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 19 Aug 2000 05:59:11 -0700
From: Susan Clark <sclark@b.......>
Subject: fanfic
Hi -
Just back from vacation and getting caught up. Sorry to hear about all
that's been going on.
But, seeing a few of the messages I do feel a need to also echo the lie
low idea as the proper course.
I think we'd be foolish to assume Sony knows nothing about the fanfic
sites. But I also think we'd be foolish to give Sony a reason to invest
more interest in them.
Disney goes after images because that's a large part of what they
do...drawings/cartoons/etc. If we did a fan-made FK series without
permission, you can bet Sony would be taking immediate interest.
Frustrating situation, and I feel for the author. But, in this case, for
fanfic, not much we can really do to help ourselves, except to not hurt
ourselves.
--Sue
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 19 Aug 2000 09:19:36 -0400
From: fkf@v.......
Subject: Re: While we're penning down fans
[xxxxxxxxxx], Canada
fkf
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 19 Aug 2000 09:36:22 -0400
From: "Susan M. Garrett" <susanmgarrett@e.......>
Subject: <No subject given>
Emily <emily.m.hanson@u.......> said:
>Not to mention that in every fanfic I have read, there is always a disclaimer
that says the author doesn't own the characters, Sony does, and I think that
most judges would say that sending something by e-mail does not constitute
publishing. >
Actually the disclaimer means NOTHING. In fact, putting the disclaimer on
fanfic makes you a target, because you're acknowledging you're doing wrong
by using someone else's characters without their permission, no matter what
you say later about not infringing. It is, essentially, waving a red flag
at a bull.
You will notice that I have never used such a disclaimer in posting my
fanfic. That's because a copyright attorney advised me against it on-line.
However, I DO put such a disclaimer in p-zines (printed fanzines), because
the disclaimer in printed material actually carries some weight. Not much,
granted, but some.
From how I've seen e-fiction develop over the years, my guess would be
p-zine writers brought the disclaimer with them to the net, thinking it
offered some protection or even using it as a matter of course - they were
so used to it, they never thought about it much - and other people just
picked it up.
As to the laws regarding the internet and copyright seem to change on an
hourly basis, it all may be a moot point anyway.
Regarding writing to Sony - by all means. Just don't mention OHG because
it's another red flag. It's sad to think it takes an event of this scary
magnitude to spur people into writing, but if it works, more power to
everybody. It's something that everyone should have been doing all along
because constantly reminding them that you want merchandise will eventually
sink in. They have such a turnover in personnel that a 'no' today might
turn into a 'yes' tomorrow. In addition to which, a cease and desist order
in Rat Patrol fandom led to Warners (?) considering a line of professional
novels, so there's precedent.
As far as it coming to Sony's attention - they probably saw a copy. They
went after it because it looked too darned professional. Most fanzines
escape attention because they're on letter paper, side bound, and look
nothing like a professional produced paperback novel. Now that POD has
made a professional looking product more likely to be within the reach of
fanzine producers, you're going to see more C and D orders.
One of the dangerous area in copyright is the production of a product that
bears similarities to a licensed product. The closer it looks to a
professionally licensed and published paperback, the quicker off the mark
the copyright holder is going to be.
And boycotts - I haven't watched USA since they attempted to cancel the
remainder of second season FK and that would be January of 1996. I've put
a parental block on that channel. If I could manage to have my cable
company remove it from my choices, I would. It doesn't mean much to anyone
except me, I suppose, but it does make me feel that I've maintained some
internal integrity.
Regards
Regards
susanmgarrett@e....... -- http://www.vitinc.com/~susang
EVER Faithful Ravenette. http://www.geocities.com/Vienna/2167/fiction.htm
"Friends help you move. Real friends help you move bodies."
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 19 Aug 2000 23:42:42 +1000
From: "Alexander J. Braun" <TALIESYN@c.......>
Subject: OT question
With Lisa's permission
To any one in the Chicago area who are FK fans, I'm going to the
58th Worldcon/Chicon in Chicago IL, the Worldcon starts the 31st
Aug ends at the 04th Sept and I'll be staying at the [xxxxxxxxxx]
Chicago from the 28th Aug to the 9th Sept and I would like very much
to meet any FK fans in the area if possible, please reply to me off
list.
Please send any reply's to the two email addy's below thank you.
AlexanderJBraun@b.......
Taliesyn@b.......
-- Alexander J. Braun -- AlexanderJBraun@b....... - ICQ # 12610993 -
-- Alexander.J.Braun@t....... - Taliesyn@b....... -
"You know, I used to think it was awful that life was so unfair. Then I
thought, wouldn't it be much worse if life were fair, and all the terrible
things that happen to us come because we actually deserve them?
So, now I take great comfort in the general hostility and unfairness of
the universe". Marcus, B5
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 19 Aug 2000 09:53:36 -0400
From: mclisa@m.......
Subject: Us and TPTB and fanfic
Scottie asks:
>I know I'm a cynic, but I'm surprised they haven't jumped on us for all the
>fk fic we write, since we're using "their" characters. Have any of TPTB ever
>questioned us, McLisa?
Not on my watch, but that doesn't mean they won't. I have suspected since
Sony bought TriStar that they have someone monitoring Forkni-l and probably
Fkfic-l. NOTE: I don't know this for a fact. Please let's be clear on that.
My guess is that our fic list isn't really a copyright threat since it's
limited to a small group of subscribers, well, small in net terms, just a
few hundred.
Perhaps we should be clear also, in case someone from Sony is reading this
and is new: The so-called virtual 4th season _is_ virtual. It's written
fanfic, not any kind of attempt to produce home video. Yes, I realize that's
not legally different but it does mean we're not claiming to be producing a
television series.
Cousin McLisa (Lisa McDavid) "That will be Trouble."
mclisa@m.......
Listowner Forkni-l, Fkfic-l, Fkv4s-l
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 19 Aug 2000 10:00:36 -0400
From: mclisa@m.......
Subject: Caligula, etc and Patrician boys
>Would a son of the Patrician class, as a future general would have to be,
>have been "entertainment"? It seems to me they would have used slave boys.
Oh, yes! One of Caligula's little amusments was opening a brothel in the
imperial palace and forcing Roman society men, including patricians, to
bring their wives to staff it. No one was safe from him, or from TIberius
after he went on his rampage. Most especially, no one was safe from Nero.
In his father's case, saying no would have been a death sentence. That is,
he would have received orders to commit suicide or else be executed and
bring public disgrace on his family.
Cousin McLisa (Lisa McDavid) "That will be Trouble."
mclisa@m.......
Listowner Forkni-l, Fkfic-l, Fkv4s-l
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 19 Aug 2000 12:00:47 EDT
From: SField8067@a.......
Subject: Re: Blitzing for the Knight: August
KtK thought that starting with TNT was a good way to test the waters with
them.See if we got a reaction of any kind, since they seem to purchase shows
fans enjoy.
Next blitz, we will include a different network along with the two we usually
do, we will just keep changing them and see who pays attention :)
so far the top two choices by you the fans seems to be UPN and CBS... so we
will definatly including them,one at a time :)
all the best,
susan ellen field
SField8067@a.......
KtK
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 19 Aug 2000 16:10:18 EDT
From: Phoenix348@a.......
Subject: Need A Beta
Since I have not been able to locate Rosemary, I'm currently interested in
finding someone who would be willing to beta-read a story that I'm working
on. The story is called "Horizons," and it is my sequel to "The Hands of
Time." The work is going rather slowly, but it is progressing nonetheless.
Anyone who is interested, please contact me off-list.
Thanks,
Stephen Lansing
Phoenix348@a.......
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 19 Aug 2000 13:33:21 -0700
From: Sherri C <sherric@e.......>
Subject: Re: Subject: Re: On Holy Ground out of print
At 08:59 8/19/2000 +0200, you wrote:
> > I know the Buffy fandom got hit hard and lost a goodly number of sites....
> >
>
>Which sites exactly? I only know about the transcripts, which were closed
>at the request of the copyright holders. The fanfiction on the same site (!)
>is still there.
As I recall they made anyone with Buffy sites with clips or waves to 'cease
& desist'... the US transcript sites were taken down, but there is one in
Germany still running...
FYI - The main Rat Patrol sites all got squelched because they were into
slash very heavily, and even tho ABC isn't doing a thing with Rat Patrol,
the lawyers were all bent out of shape due to the tarnishing of their
heros' reputations.
Let us NOT upset the apple cart... those lawyer types are tricky.
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 19 Aug 2000 20:54:39 GMT
From: Lorelei Sieja <lorisieja@h.......>
Subject: Re: Blitzing for the Knight: August
I would put in a "no" vote for UPN... It is not carried by enough cable and
dish providers. TNT and CBS are widely available. I don't think I've ever
lived in an area that didn't offer both on their cable and dish networks.
Now I know that major cities are required to drop CBS from their dish
programming, to force the viewers to watch the local CBS network, and
therefore listen to local advertizements. But, CBS is still available. I
cannot get UPN here, nor in any of the last four places I lived, in three
different states. We want as many fans possible! Let's not disable our
efforts by chosing a network with a limited viewing audience.
<<KtK thought that starting with TNT was a good way to test the waters with
them..(snip)....so far the top two choices by you the fans seems to be UPN
and CBS...
susan ellen field
SField8067@a.......
KtK>>>
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End of FORKNI-L Digest - 19 Aug 2000 (#2000-260)
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