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Digest - 4 Aug 2006 to 5 Aug 2006 (#2006-209)

Sat, 5 Aug 2006

There are 13 messages totalling 388 lines in this issue.

Topics of the day:

  1. Episode discussion: For I Have Sinned-- new question (12)
  2. Today's Birthday:  August 5

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Date:    Fri, 4 Aug 2006 15:14:44 -0600
From:    Angela Gottfred <agottfre@t.......>
Subject: Re: Episode discussion: For I Have Sinned-- new question

> Nick was so affected by being IN the church, how could
> he sit in the confessional and be "okay"?

I think the idea was that the confessional was free of religious symbols such as
crosses, saint's statues (BTW, the saint was St. Anthony of Padua, patron saint
of lost things), altars, etc. Remember the scene where Nick asks Nat to bring
Joan's cross closer, because he'll be "spending the day in a church"?

Your humble & obedient servant,
Angela Gottfred

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Date:    Fri, 4 Aug 2006 14:37:26 -0700
From:    Kristen Fife <fenix23fyre@y......>
Subject: Re: Episode discussion: For I Have Sinned-- new question

Yes, but to me, the Confessional is every bit as
sanctified as a cross, if not more so. It makes you
wonder how the writers defined "objects" and whether
it was just the cross itself or the entire ambience of
the church that was responsible for vampires'
reactions. Or, was it the blessing of the object/space
itself that was indicative? If that would be the case,
then a Protestant church wouldn't have the same
results. And we never really saw how any of the FK
vampires reacted to, say, a Star of David.

--- Angela Gottfred <agottfre@t.......> wrote:

>
> I think the idea was that the confessional was free
> of religious symbols such as
> crosses, saint's statues (BTW, the saint was St.
> Anthony of Padua, patron saint
> of lost things), altars, etc.

"The price for this gift is the darkness of the night, and the blood of
humanity to sustain you." -THICKER THAN WATER, Kristen Fife in progress
See my blog at http://spaces.msn.com/members/landinn/


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Date:    Fri, 4 Aug 2006 15:53:58 -0600
From:    Angela Gottfred <agottfre@t.......>
Subject: Re: Episode discussion: For I Have Sinned-- new question

>And we never really saw how any of the FK
> vampires reacted to, say, a Star of David.

Actually, there was one episode where Nick looked at a menorah and was
apparently uncomfortable. And don't forget the obsidian knives in Blackwing.

I think the writers probably weren't interested in conveying the finer points
of the Catholic faith.

Your humble & obedient servant,
Angela Gottfred

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Date:    Fri, 4 Aug 2006 14:59:08 -0700
From:    Amanda Berendt <debrabant_foundation@y......>
Subject: Re: Episode discussion: For I Have Sinned-- new question

--- Kristen Fife <fenix23fyre@y......> wrote:
>  And we never really saw how any of the FK
> vampires reacted to, say, a Star of David.
>

Actually we did... I think it was AMPH when Nick goes to the
wake-thing of the scientist who supposedly killed herself and he
flinches at a menorah that is sitting on a side table.

-Amanda

"This dark gift brings enlightened sight, as if the sun's bright rays
illuminate sweet mortal forms to take my breath away."
http://www.darksideoftheglass.com


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Date:    Sat, 5 Aug 2006 00:43:42 +0200
From:    P J <blue_twingo772@y.......>
Subject: Re: Episode discussion: For I Have Sinned-- new question

Kristen Fife <fenix23fyre@y...... wrote:
  > OK, here is something I have always wondered about. Nick was so affected by
being IN the church, how could he sit in the confessional and be "okay"? <

  I think he was okay there because it was just a plain room, lacking any
visible symbols compared to the church where he had to face crosses and other
holy items everywhere.

  Petra.


------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 4 Aug 2006 18:53:01 -0400
From:    Cheryl <fknight420@c.......>
Subject: Re: Episode discussion: For I Have Sinned-- new question

A thought, if you will; a confessional box is for all sinners, all meaning
no religon, can't spell, to the church he was a sinner, he was allowed in
there and it was the blessed symbols that taunted him.
Cheryl / fknight420@c.......



'Angus Grady; The Beginning--available in
bookstores nationwide.

Don't trade a treasure
for an empty box.
ForeverKnight.5u.com
AngusGrady.50megs.com
BradleyFarley.50megs.com

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Date:    Fri, 4 Aug 2006 19:05:55 -0600
From:    Angela Gottfred <agottfre@t.......>
Subject: Re: Episode discussion: For I Have Sinned-- new question

> A thought, if you will; a confessional box is for all sinners

Good point! If there's one place where Nick should feel okay inside a church,
it would probably be the confessional. Although I'm not sure it's completely
correct to say that the confessional is for all sinners; the confessional is
where the Sacrament of Reconciliation (Confession) takes place, and this
sacrament is for Catholics. (Although there are exceptions and special cases.)
Non-Catholics don't believe in it, so they usually aren't too interested in
receiving this sacrament. We're pretty sure Nick is Catholic, though, since he
was a crusader.

The joke on Nick and Schanke is that this story clearly takes place during Lent
(the draped cross, and the "Easter Pageant" for which the cross was erected).
During Lent, all Catholics are strongly encouraged to go to Reconciliation, and
there usually are lots of extra times given for Reconciliation, beyond what is
scheduled the rest of the year (typically, Saturday afternoons). Ordinarily,
Nick would probably be undisturbed by priests or penitents if he chose to hide
away in the confessional; but Schanke, being a Catholic and well aware that
it's Lent, may have felt particularly pricked by his conscience because of his
encounter with Alma. Finding himself away from his home church (some people
feel uncomfortable confessing to their parish priests, and priests from other
parishes are frequently brought in for Reconciliation during Lent), he figured
that this stake-out could provide a great opportunity to make his Lenten
Reconciliation. The schedule for Reconciliation is pretty readily available
within most churches, if you know where to look. You really have to feel sorry
for the guy...

Your humble & obedient servant,
Angela Gottfred

------------------------------

Date:    Sat, 5 Aug 2006 00:29:01 -0700
From:    KC Monroe <kaysea1228@y......>
Subject: Re: Episode discussion: For I Have Sinned-- new question


>   I think he was okay there because it was just a
> plain room, lacking any visible symbols compared to
> the church where he had to face crosses and other
> holy items everywhere.
>

I've always wondered about this because Nick is
sitting on the priest's side not the penitent's. The
confessional in the church I went to had Crucifix
inside the priest's cubicle.

KC


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Date:    Sat, 5 Aug 2006 15:33:00 +0100
From:    Luicia <luicia1705@y.......>
Subject: Re: Episode discussion: For I Have Sinned-- new question

Could it be argues then that whatever a person's religious affiliation was when
they were mortal, the stronger the effect of the symbols of that religion?
Though that does not fully explain Lacroix' aversion to crosses... any
explaination on that one???

Amanda Berendt <debrabant_foundation@y......> wrote:  --- Kristen Fife wrote:
> And we never really saw how any of the FK
> vampires reacted to, say, a Star of David.
>

Actually we did... I think it was AMPH when Nick goes to the
wake-thing of the scientist who supposedly killed herself and he
flinches at a menorah that is sitting on a side table.

-Amanda

"This dark gift brings enlightened sight, as if the sun's bright rays
illuminate sweet mortal forms to take my breath away."
http://www.darksideoftheglass.com



"Life is what happens when you're busy making other plans" John Lennon


------------------------------

Date:    Sat, 5 Aug 2006 10:30:53 -0500
From:    eowyn23@j.......
Subject: Today's Birthday:  August 5

Hi Y'all!

Today is the birthday of:

Our List Gardener, Don Fasig                argent@c.......

You may send birthday greetings to Don at the above email address.
Please NOT to the list!

Others who share this birthday:
Loni Anderson, TV Actress
Neil Alden Armstrong, Astronaut
Pietro Antonio Cesti, Composer
Naum Gabo, Sculptor
John Merrick, "The Elephant Man"

Significant events on this date:
1583, the first English settlement in North America was founded at St.
John's Newfoundland by English navigator Humphrey Gilbert.
1844, the cornerstone for the Statue of Liberty was laid at Bedloe's
Island in New York Harbor.
1891, first travelers checks issued (American Express).
1923, Henry Sullivan became the first American to swim across the English
Channel.

I hope you have a very Happy Birthday, Don!

If you would like to be added to the birthday announcements, please send
your name, birthdate (no year needed) and email address to me,
eowyn23@j......., privately, and I'll be glad to add you.

Terri
eowyn23@j.......
GWDFC, FK X-Stitcher, Proud Survivor of FK Fic Wars 8-12, Texas Knight
Dreamers, Knighties List Owner, Keeper of the FK Birthday List

------------------------------

Date:    Sat, 5 Aug 2006 11:52:15 -0700
From:    Liz the Lucky <lizthelucky@c.......>
Subject: Re: Episode discussion: For I Have Sinned-- new question

Lucia asked:

> Though that does not fully explain Lacroix' aversion to
> crosses... any explaination on that one???

I've maintained for years that it's not *faith* or Goodness that burns a
vampire, but Light/Sun/Fire symbols. This works with the cross (I am the
*Light* of the world), the menorah (the oil burns for seven days and night
when there was only enough for one day), the Raven knifes (Tracy
specifically mentions the myth about Raven stealing the Sun right before
Nick grabs one of them and gets burn). Give me time to reread up on Egyptian
mythology and I think I can get the ankh worked in there as well.

Did anyone else notice that when Nick fell against the statue in the church
he did *not* burn?


Hugs and Kisses,
Liz the Lucky             lizthelucky@c.......
http://www.lizthelucky.com/ForeverKnight/
Merc House Mommy

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Date:    Sat, 5 Aug 2006 15:20:00 -0500
From:    Nancy Kaminski <nancykam@c.......>
Subject: Re: Episode discussion: For I Have Sinned-- new question

> KC Monroe wrote:

> I've always wondered about this because Nick is
> sitting on the priest's side not the penitent's. The
> confessional in the church I went to had Crucifix
> inside the priest's cubicle.

YEah, so did the confessional in my church. Plus, the screen between
the priest and the penitent was pierced in the pattern of a
cross---all in all, not very friendly to a vampire.

But we'll just assume that this church has very plain, undecorated
confessionals.

Nancy Kaminski

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Date:    Sat, 5 Aug 2006 21:41:43 +0100
From:    Luicia <luicia1705@y.......>
Subject: Re: Episode discussion: For I Have Sinned-- new question

Well the statues in churches are blessed and Nick would have known that so
maybe it was an oversight by the director.

Liz the Lucky <lizthelucky@c.......> wrote:

Did anyone else notice that when Nick fell against the statue in the church
he did *not* burn?




"Life is what happens when you're busy making other plans" John Lennon


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End of FORKNI-L Digest - 4 Aug 2006 to 5 Aug 2006 (#2006-209)
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