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FORKNI-L Digest - 16 Aug 2002 to 17 Aug 2002 (#2002-244)

Sat, 17 Aug 2002

There are 13 messages totalling 469 lines in this issue.

Topics of the day:

  1. blood wine???
  2. FK vamp fangs and entrance wounds (was "Blood in the Stomach") (4)
  3. Who's to Blame in LYtD? (2)
  4. Here is Season 2 (2)
  5. [Fwd: Canadians Only Read This] (2)
  6. YKYBWTMFKW...
  7. John Kapelos in Victoria, BC

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Date:    Fri, 16 Aug 2002 14:30:44 -0700
From:    Sunny LaCountess <countessa2000@y.......>
Subject: Re: blood wine???

I was always under the impression that vampires drank
blood for its nourishment and that their stomach was a
place where it got absorbed into their blood stream
rather than being broken down (I vaguely remember reading
somewhere that a vampire's stomach doesn't have digestive
fluids.)

About the soul/karma thing, Nick said in Francesca that
they read a victim's thoughts and memories through their
blood, but didn't say anything about possessing their
soul. I don't think that is part of the FK universe.

Cheers & chocolate,

Sunny

=====
LaCountess -- Twilight Knightie,IB,DT,UF,Cotk
http://www.lacountess.com/FKnight/

"Vampires are make believe, just like elves and gremlins and eskimos!"           
--Homer Simpson

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 16 Aug 2002 14:41:10 -0700
From:    "D. K. Kraft" <cat@e.......>
Subject: FK vamp fangs and entrance wounds (was "Blood in the Stomach")

allison wrote:
>
> Here's a bit of thought sparking for everyone.  As the traditional vampire's
> fangs are located, the canine teeth (Nick and Co.) they would not be able to
> bite the way they do.  The teeth would cause more of a tearing effect than
> two puncture marks.

        I respectfully disagree.  Anyone who has seen the damage left behind by
a brutal cat fight knows that *any* canine teeth shaped like fangs will leave
quite definitive puncture wounds (that quickly turn into nasty
abscesses--ick!).  The placement of human canine teeth is the same as any
other species that is either an omnivore (look at bears and chimpanzees) or an
obligate carnivore.  I don't believe that tooth placement has any bearing on
the entrance/exit wound shape.

        Yes, in the case of a vampire bite, there would be some elongation of
the wounds, reflecting the downward angle and tissue resistance, and resulting 
in a more length-wise, oval puncture, rather than a picture-perfect circle.
However, the fangs would still create a very distinctive puncture wound.

        The above, though, is based on the supposition that vampire fangs are
shaped either like reptile (snakes), feline, canine, or simian (think chimpanzee 
or baboon) predatory canine teeth.  If they are indeed an *elongation* of the
human canine tooth as we know it, the wound left would still be a puncture
wound, but more of a horizontal (left to right) oblong shape, since the modern
human canine tooth is "flatter" than the others listed above.

        My own pet theory is that FK vampire fangs are more reptilian in nature
and drop down from a pocket in the front of the maxilla (upper jaw), sliding 
over the normal canine teeth until they "lock" into place.  The fangs must have 
an indentation on their upper underside to accommodate the normal canine teeth
and provide the fangs themselves with additional support--hence the slight
"bulge" behind the upper lip when the fangs are down.  Any bleeding caused by
tissue damage as the fangs descend/return would, of course, heal
immediately--kind of like Wolverine and his adamantine claws. ;-)


What can I say?  I'm a biology/zoology major --
--
     /\ /\                      |  "There are many intelligent species
     ^o o^     D.K. "Cat" Kraft |   in the universe. They are all
     ->T<-     cat@e.......   |   owned by cats."
       ~       Lynnwood, WA     |
___oOO___OOo___                 |                        -- Anonymous

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 16 Aug 2002 14:46:15 -0700
From:    Sunny LaCountess <countessa2000@y.......>
Subject: Re: Who's to Blame in LYtD?

I think Beverly, that you are absolutely right in your
assessment of this. I always thought Nick's accusation of
LaCroix was only an excuse to justify his own behavior,
just as his pure/evil speech to Sylvain that you quoted
was. No matter whom he blames, bottom line still is, he
wanted to bite her and needed an pretext, somewhat like
the same things some rapists say when they are confronted
in the court: "But she initiated it. She led me to
believe she wanted it. She seemed to enjoy it.  She was
impure and she didn't mind it." all bullshit of course,
and all said to put the blame on someone else.

Sunny


=====
LaCountess -- Twilight Knightie,IB,DT,UF,Cotk
http://www.lacountess.com/FKnight/

"Vampires are make believe, just like elves and gremlins and eskimos!"           
--Homer Simpson

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 16 Aug 2002 14:46:44 -0700
From:    Sunny LaCountess <countessa2000@y.......>
Subject: Here is Season 2

=====
LaCountess -- Twilight Knightie,IB,DT,UF,Cotk
http://www.lacountess.com/FKnight/

"Vampires are make believe, just like elves and gremlins and eskimos!"           
--Homer Simpson

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 16 Aug 2002 14:54:55 -0700
From:    Sunny LaCountess <countessa2000@y.......>
Subject: Here is Season 2

Sorry for the blank email, my finger slipped and I sent
the email before typing it.

Anyway, I have posted the Season 2 reviews on my site. I
planned it so it would be at the same time as SciFi
channel started airing the season. Hope you like them. To
access the page, go to:
http://www.lacountess.com/FKnight/Episodes.html
and click on Season II.

On an entirely different note, I had to raise the
security shield in my computer up a few notches because
of some unwanted hackings. I'm not sure how that will
affect my website but if anyone sees any problems in
loading or surfing pages in the site, please let me know
and I'll look into it.

Thanks and hope you have fun,

Sunny


=====
LaCountess -- Twilight Knightie,IB,DT,UF,Cotk
http://www.lacountess.com/FKnight/

"Vampires are make believe, just like elves and gremlins and eskimos!"           
--Homer Simpson

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 16 Aug 2002 14:57:04 -0700
From:    Sunny LaCountess <countessa2000@y.......>
Subject: Re: [Fwd: Canadians Only Read This]

 Marg <mytoronto@r.......> wrote:

> John Ross Mc Master wrote:
> > September 7th on Space---FK Season 1 Ep 1 begins

love you Marg. That' one good news for us, Canadian fans.

Gotta dust my VCR :)

Sunny

=====
LaCountess -- Twilight Knightie,IB,DT,UF,Cotk
http://www.lacountess.com/FKnight/

"Vampires are make believe, just like elves and gremlins and eskimos!"           
--Homer Simpson

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 16 Aug 2002 18:17:47 -0400
From:    Amanda Berendt <debrabant@h.......>
Subject: YKYBWTMFKW...

Well I can't actually say "Watching" but.... anyhoo

This morning when I got in my car to go to work, I happened to look at the
milage meter it was EXACTLY.... 12280.
So I got my little gin this morning.
-Amanda

"Peace over anger. Honor over hate. Strength over fear."
http://operacellar.tripod.com/phantomslair.html
or
http://debrabantfoundation.tripod.com/home.html
  (in progress - soon to be an FK Charity site - I will gladly share the
space with others if people want)


------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 16 Aug 2002 20:04:28 -0000
From:    Barbara Vainio <bevainio@w.......>
Subject: Re: FK vamp fangs and entrance wounds (was "Blood in the Stomach")

D. K. Kraft wrote:


Barb

>
>         I respectfully disagree.  Anyone who has seen the damage left behind
> by a brutal cat fight knows that *any* canine teeth shaped like fangs will
> leave quite definitive puncture wounds

This is true, but there are usually top & bottom wounds because the cat (or
dog) bites *around* the skin, either pinching it between the 2 jaws or
clamping their teeth around a wrist or other body part.  FK vampire marks
(and most others I've seen are just 2 puncture wounds, more like those that
would be made by a needle or an awl.  That would more support the snake
theory of fang deployment :-)
Barb

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 16 Aug 2002 20:14:05 -0400
From:    Debbie Clarke <dittany121@h.......>
Subject: Re: [Fwd: Canadians Only Read This]

At last.,  I know it has only been a year but it has seemed a lot longer.

Debbie



>From: Marg <mytoronto@r.......>

>
>John Ross Mc Master wrote:
> > September 7th on Space---FK Season 1 Ep 1 begins
> >
> > Love that Space (cable channel)!!!
>
>Canadians, start your VCRs! <g>


------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 16 Aug 2002 21:10:12 -0400
From:    Debbie Clarke <dittany121@h.......>
Subject: Re: Who's to Blame in LYtD?

Although  I agree that Nick wanted to bite Sylvain and that he used the
excuse that she was impure to justify himself endulging his baser desires.
(after all   you would think by this time he would have learned to  think
before he believed anything LaCroix told him)  at the same time  I don't
think you can   completely absolve LaCroix  from blame in this matter.
LaCroix  knew his son.   He  therefore knew  full well what the consequences
would be when he sent his friends   to visit Sylvain.  That is why he did
it.     Ballet dancers etc  back then  had a reputation for being
promiscuous.    Having seen what he thought he saw and knowing  that
reputation  it is not surprising   Nick would  jump to the conclusion he
did.

Debbie


------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 16 Aug 2002 18:16:24 -0700
From:    "D. K. Kraft" <cat@e.......>
Subject: Re: FK vamp fangs and entrance wounds (was "Blood in the Stomach")

Barbara Vainio wrote:
>
> This is true, but there are usually top & bottom wounds because the cat (or
> dog) bites *around* the skin

        Actually, this depends on how good a purchase the attacking critter
obtains on its victim with the mandible (lower jaw).  Think about it:  the 
maxilla (upper jaw) has the biting force behind it from the larger jaw and 
cranial muscles, with the mandible being secondary with smaller muscles.  Bite 
into an apple (or some similar fruit) in slow motion and feel how this action 
takes place with your own muscles.  The bite mark will likely show a deeper 
gouge where your upper jaw cut into the fruit, with the mandible having made a 
more shallow one.

        Following this, a vampire's mandible may or may not actually score the
flesh, since the focus of the bite is to puncture as deeply as possible with 
the fangs and then secure a good seal around the resulting wound for maximum 
blood flow/minimum leakage.  I would expect to see heavy bruising on a victim's
throat in the area where the lower jaw made initial contact, or some minor
skin laceration.  I would also expect to see the same degree of damage done by
the incisors between the fangs.

        This in no way weakens my rebuttal of Allison's original post, that the
position of vampire fangs in the same maxilla location as human canine teeth
would indeed cause distinctive puncture wounds at the point of entry, rather
than tearing as she suggested.  A body simply cannot have a fang of any sort
penetrate that deeply and not result in a puncture wound.

> FK vampire marks > (and most others I've seen are just 2 puncture wounds, more
> like those that would be made by a needle or an awl.  That would more support
> the snake theory of fang deployment :-)

        First off, you have to consider the fact that this is a representation
done by TV make-up artists who likely aren't going for a veracity award--it 
would require a bit more research, time, and funding than they were wont to put 
into one instance of make-up on a most-of-the-time "dead" body, seen only for 
a few seconds of film time.

        Second, there's a bit of a misconception here that a venomous snake
dislocates its jaw when it bites:  it does not.  Snakes only dislocate their
jaws to swallow large prey.  It takes a venomous snake (or any snake for that
matter) at least five to ten seconds to completely dislocate its jaw in order
to swallow prey--an action that takes far too long in real time for it to
perform during a bite, since the biting action occurs quite literally faster
than the human eye can track.  When seen in slow motion during a bite, the
snake can be seen to "lead" with its fangs into its prey.  The resulting
wound?  Two nearly round puncture marks with secondary bruising (when seen on
human skin).

        I firmly believe that FK vampires can cause such characteristic puncture
wounds, but likely with associated bruising/damage that just wasn't shown on
the show, as I said, due to costs, time, etc.  From a realistic view, the
fangs (once descended) are probably more like a chimpanzee's in relative
size/shape than anything else.  A chimp's jaw structure more closely matches
modern man than any other primate, and the fangs don't overlap the mandible
as, say, in the muzzle of a cat.


Forgive my loquaciousness: I am a biologist and a writer: dangerous combo --
--
     /\ /\                      |  "There are many intelligent species
     ^o o^     D.K. "Cat" Kraft |   in the universe. They are all
     ->T<-     cat@e.......   |   owned by cats."
       ~       Lynnwood, WA     |
___oOO___OOo___                 |                        -- Anonymous

------------------------------

Date:    Sat, 17 Aug 2002 07:49:53 -0700
From:    Emily <emilymhanson@y.......>
Subject: Re: FK vamp fangs and entrance wounds (was "Blood in the Stomach")

I think it also comes down to what level of realism the writers/producers
figured one would expect in a vampire TV show such as FK.  I'm sure they did 
their best given whatever budgets and resources they had.  It's also possible 
the producers decided that it might not be worth the time and effort to do all 
of that extra research to make things as realistic as possible, especially given 
that the vision of the show was surrealistic.

As a fan fiction writer who also has a day job, I'll research something if it is
absolutely necessary to the plot, but I don't have the time to spend hours of
research on every little detail.  It comes down to what would you expect in a TV
series about vampires?  If a story is an original drama where the plot hinges on
many facts, especially little-known facts, I would expect the author to have
done the research in question.

Something like the shape of a vampire bite has been described many times in
various forms of literature, beginning with the earliest legends of Dracula, 
so I'm not too surprised that the writers didn't do a lot of research on that.  
For me personally, it didn't take anything away from the experience of watching 
FK.  What mattered to me the most was watching the characters interact and how 
the sub-plots tied into the main plot.  Things like tiny details don't matter 
that much to me unless they are waaaaay off and create major plot holes.

--- "D. K. Kraft" <cat@e.......> wrote:
     I firmly believe that FK vampires can cause such characteristic puncture
> wounds, but likely with associated bruising/damage that just wasn't shown on
> the show, as I said, due to costs, time, etc.

=====
Emily M. Hanson
Homepage - http://www.starbase-eprime.us
My Web Graphics - http://www.galaxyofimages.us

------------------------------

Date:    Sat, 17 Aug 2002 08:38:15 -0700
From:    Red <red@s.......>
Subject: John Kapelos in Victoria, BC

Unfortunatly this info is a bit late, but John Kapelos has been in Victoria,
BC shooting a new movie called "Croon".  I understand it's about an older
woman who falls for a younger man - the younger man being John Kapelos.

Here's a link to information on the production. I know it doesn't have
Scha...er.. John's name in there, but I did read about it in the local paper
(Times-Colonist) so I know it's true.  Sadly, I work when they seem to be
filming, so I haven't seen him myself. =(

http://www.filmvictoria.com/locfilm.htm

Keeping my eyes peeled, just in case,

Amy
________________________________________________________________
"Summer afternoon - summer afternoon; to me those have always
been the two most beautiful words in the english language." - Henry James

------------------------------

End of FORKNI-L Digest - 16 Aug 2002 to 17 Aug 2002 (#2002-244)
***************************************************************


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