FORKNI-L

FORKNI-L Digest - 8 Nov 2001 to 9 Nov 2001 (#2001-339)

Fri, 9 Nov 2001

There are 20 messages totalling 592 lines in this issue.

Topics of the day:

  1. Special Forever Knight Offer on Ebay (5)
  2. poetic vision and Forever Knight (6)
  3. p.v. and FK
  4. Admin: Selling, EBAY and FK
  5. YKYBR/WTMFKW...
  6. hallucinations (5)
  7. Surprise Nigel Bennett sighting

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Date:    Thu, 8 Nov 2001 16:08:36 -0600
From:    Kristin <kris1228@s.......>
Subject: Special Forever Knight Offer on Ebay

To all Forever Knight fans,

This may be of strong interest to those of you who are lacking FK tapes or
have some that could use some improvements. This is also for those who can
not download movies off my site or have a connection too slow to download
large files.

How many of you are in the US and would love to see *extra* footage and also
get a BONUS item? How many of you have a nice DVD player or computer
CD-ROM/DVD-ROM that needs some cool stuff to play? How many of you would
like to see *high-quality* episodes of Forever Knight on ever-lasting CDs?
Well, then here's how to get an extra set of Forever Knight Season 1 on VCD,
that I am offering...

Just listed on Wednesday, Nov. 7th on eBay:

eBay Item #1483447902

For pictures and lots of info, click here:

"Forever Knight" Season One on VCD
http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1483447902

Take advantage of this rare offer while you can and feel free to e-mail me
with any questions (be sure to visit the above address first).

Thank you,
Kristin
http://knightvision.4ever.cc
"When you only have eyes for the Knight..."

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 8 Nov 2001 15:32:09 -0700
From:    Kyer <kyer@p.......>
Subject: Re: Special Forever Knight Offer on Ebay

Kristin wrote:
> This may be of strong interest to those of you who are lacking FK tapes or
> have some that could use some improvements. This is also for those who can
> not download movies off my site or have a connection too slow to download
> large files.

Well, improperly removed prune pits! <g>
*I* wanted to get DSL, but noooooo.  Those who rule the phone lines
gainsayed that idea.

Kristin, you need to make more copies of those copies!  I have this little
gut feeling that your ebay offering is going to go through the roof very
quickly because it looks like you did one bang-up terrific job on that.
Very professional looking.  *thumbs up!*

:)=
Kyer, currently out with a bedridden dad, hobbled mom, and a job that she
came >< close to quitting today because of the idiots at work. "Those
brand-new legally required signs?  They were in our way so we threw them
out."  How much to hire LaCroix for a hit job?  I want my coworkers thwaked
soundly with a large zuchinni squash.

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 8 Nov 2001 15:14:18 -0800
From:    Sunny LaCountess <countessa2000@y.......>
Subject: Re: poetic vision and Forever Knight

Even though I had sworn to stay in lurking mode for the
duration of this term, the Fk fans’ discussions are
sometimes so thoughtful, so sharp and intelligent that it
is impossible to read the comments and not be tempted to
respond. Honestly, issues as deep and philosophical as the
ones I encountered on Fk lists weren't even discussed in my
philosophy or psychology classes.

As for the central theme of the show, I agree with both Kly
and Molly. And to add to their views, in my opinion, the
show is also in a way about us: the fans of the vampire
myth. Do we ever dream about meeting a vampire? Do we
fantasize about having a vampire as our love interest?
daydream about the bite? Of course, if we do we would want
it to be a nice vampire, one who doesn't kill, and is as
gentle and caring as any lover could be.

Natalie is us. She feels all these, and the show goes into
detail about what it would be like if that fantasy came
true. The amazing thing about FK is that even though this
storyline has a big potential of becoming a cheese dripping
soap opera, the show takes the most brutal and realistic
approach possible towards it. It shows us the truth about
wanting something you can't have and its outcome. Of course
I too oppose the negative sharp turns that Parriot took at
the end, and I’m happy that Ger and eventually Sony pushed
him to leave the ending open, but I liked the conversation
Nick and LaCroix had at the end of LK. The sentence "You
are my best friend" shattered a lot of misconceptions about
FK’s theme, a major one being the idea that LaCroix was the
evil bad guy.

Still I don’t think the show implied that LaCroix was
right. I don’t think it implied that anyone was right. Just
as there were no purely good or evil characters in the
show, there was no right answer to the issue either, just
like in real life, and that IMO is the whole point. If it
were in fact real life, the mortal would most probably be
attracted to the vampire because that’s how nature intended
it to be, perhaps as another advantage for the vampire for
the sake of it’s survival. The vampire would still kill the
mortal due to his natural instinct, and it would end in
tragedy one way or another. It would have been in
everyone’s best interest if Nick had left town early or
stayed with LaCroix, or if Natalie had never fallen in love
with him, but that is most likely not the way it would have
happened had it been in real life and based on what we know
about the characters. The thing is, FK is not afraid, or
ashamed to show us the facts, to hurt instead of pampering
us, and that IMO is the brilliance of the show.


=====
Countess -- Twilight Knightie,IB,DT,UF,Cotk
"What time is it, what day is it, what century is it?"

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 8 Nov 2001 19:08:55 EST
From:    Libratsie@a.......
Subject: Re: Special Forever Knight Offer on Ebay

In a message dated 11/8/01 4:08:38 PM Central Standard Time,
kris1228@s....... writes:

<< Well, then here's how to get an extra set of Forever Knight Season 1 on VCD,
 that I am offering...

 Just listed on Wednesday, Nov. 7th on eBay: >>
Isn't this a major copyright infrigement??? I'm just asking as TPTB have been
VERY generous in letting us exchange tapes as long as we don't profit. But
listing items on eBay could cause them to start cracking down ;-) And it
could also be against eBay policy.

No offense intended, I just don't want anyone to get in trouble! ;-)

Libby

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 8 Nov 2001 18:22:56 -0600
From:    Kristin <kris1228@s.......>
Subject: Re: Special Forever Knight Offer on Ebay

Not unless you are making a huge profit, which I am not. It pays for
supplies, wear on burner, etc. I've seen old tapes on ebay sell in the 100's
and that's just a set of old tapes in the lowest quality mode.

I'm just making a rare offer to the people who have trouble downloading
these off my site.

Kristin


> Isn't this a major copyright infrigement???
> No offense intended, I just don't want anyone to get in trouble! ;-)
>
> Libby

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 9 Nov 2001 00:08:04 EST
From:    Libratsie@a.......
Subject: Re: Special Forever Knight Offer on Ebay

n a message dated 11/8/01 6:23:07 PM Central Standard Time,
kris1228@s....... writes:

<< Not unless you are making a huge profit, which I am not. It pays for
 supplies, wear on burner, etc. I've seen old tapes on ebay sell in the 100's
 and that's just a set of old tapes in the lowest quality mode. >>

Again, I just don't want to get anyone in trouble, but even if you AREN'T
making a profit, *any* duplication is technically illegal. The FK powers have
been very kind in letting us exchange tapes and provide copies to FK fans at
cost for tapes and postage. This could change if such fan produced products
end up at auctions. I'm a writing, so I know a *little* (and I do stress a
*little*) about copyright issues. I've also had some film classes that
focused on the movie/tv industry.

It is also against ebay's policies whether others have done it or not. I know
this as I was curious about finding another tv series on tape and looked at
the policies earlier this week ;-)

Again, not meant to offend - I just don't want TPTB to start shutting down
our FK sites that violate there copyrights! This includes: fanfic, videos (to
download), pictures (yes, even captured stills are copyrighted), and so
forth. It *has* happened to other fandoms so we've been very fortunate.

Libs

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 9 Nov 2001 00:12:24 -0500
From:    Bonnie Rutledge <llamababe@c.......>
Subject: Re: poetic vision and Forever Knight

Sunny wrote:
<snip> in my opinion, the show is also in a way about us: the fans of the
vampire myth.<snip>

Only some people, like me, didn't get started watching the show because of
that. I stopped channel surfing to watch 'Dark Knight' because I thought it was
a cop show. It wasn't a matter of the characters being vampires that kept me
interested. I think it was the broader scope, the issues that the format of the
show opened channels to explore: what constitutes good, evil, humanity, and
morality; being an outsider; fighting an addiction; corruption of power;
science v. religion, rational v. romantic; dealing with all manner of
relationships, be they with family, friends or lovers; finding a place in a
chaotic world filled with obstacles and opportunities; the inevitability of
death and how we cope.

And, coincidentally, this is almost exactly the list of reasons why I watch
'The West Wing' now. Granted, the writing levels of the two series are not
equal, but my point is that the beauty of FK for me was not in that it was a
show with vampires, or a love story, or filled with one overall message. FK was
a series capable of inspiring thought, a rare and endangered species among
television shows.

<waves>

*************************************************************************
Bonnie Rutledge<-------------------------------Omnifemale Llama!
The Touch The Feel Of Cotton!... llamababe@c.......
  "If you don't look like hell, you aren't trying hard enough."

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 8 Nov 2001 23:29:44 -0600
From:    "Nancy E. Kaminski" <nancykam@m.......>
Subject: Re: poetic vision and Forever Knight

Bons wrote:

> Only some people, like me, didn't get started watching the
> show because of that. I stopped channel surfing to watch 'Dark Knight'
> because I thought it was a cop show. It wasn't a matter of the characters being
> vampires that kept me interested.

I have to join Bons in this sentiment---I'm not the least bit interested in
vampires, and I never thought of FK as a vampire show.

> I think it was the broader scope, the issues that
> the format of the show opened channels to explore: what constitutes good, evil,
> humanity, and morality; being an outsider; fighting an addiction;
> corruption of power; science v. religion, rational v. romantic;

<snip>

Absolutely. The issues brought up by this show were the broad themes of great
literature, something quite amazing in television. This was a show that
motivated fans to think.

> overall message. FK was a series capable of inspiring thought, a rare and endangered
> species among television shows.

And the lists---ah, the email lists! No other show I've watched has inspired the
kind of discussion we've enjoyed on FORKNI-L. HIstory, religion, morality,
philosophy...those are only a few of the topics that have been discussed. I
doubt I'll ever find the equal anywhere else.

Nancy Kaminski
nancykam@m.......

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 8 Nov 2001 21:35:30 -0800
From:    Klytaimnestra <klytaimnestra@s.......>
Subject: Re: p.v. and FK

on 11/8/01 2:00 PM, J. Kocich wrote:

> do you mean "negative" in that Nick and Nat
> aren't mortal, together, by the end of the series?

No, I would never have expected that either.  The most positive I hoped for
was that Nat would accept Nick's vampirism, and Nick would accept it too,
and both could still go on, perhaps together.

But Last Knight is distressingly negative.  I think however (now that I've
thought about it more) that perhaps you're right, and in season 1 & 2
Parriott was prepared to be a good deal more positive about the
possibilities of the situation.  Then in season 3, when a lot of the
'positive' stuff had been taken out of the show already, he reverted to his
original idea.  Which still seemed a more 'natural' ending to him than one
in which people somehow manage to go on.  At least it WAS an ending.

Or so he thought at least!  Sony/Tristar had other ideas.

L

--
Klytaimnestra         klytaimnestra@s.......
Fanfiction at http://www.klytaimnestra.com

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 9 Nov 2001 01:46:01 EST
From:    Libratsie@a.......
Subject: Re: poetic vision and Forever Knight

In a message dated 11/8/01 11:26:53 PM Central Standard Time,
llamababe@c....... writes:

<< Only some people, like me, didn't get started watching the show because of
 that. I stopped channel surfing to watch 'Dark Knight' because I thought it was
 a cop show.  >>
I can't resist sharing again how I became a fan of the show. I'd just been in
a serious car wreck, my second in 18 months, and a friend was over visiting
me. He begged to watch the 3rd season premiere. I was familiar with the show
from having heard friends talk about it, and think I may have caught part of
an episode when they were still on CBS. So I said "sure."

I was intrigued enough by the story to watch the next week. By then, the
Valium I'd been prescribed as a muscle relaxer was building up in my system.
Unknown to me or my doctor, I was overdosing and quite high by the time I
watched the second episode of the third season.

So the thought of a Cockney Carouche eating rats warmed me 'eart.

I'm an FK fan AND a Ratpacker due to an overdose of Valium.

(The overdose was caught within a few days and let's say coming off that was
a fine ride, but not one I'd care to repeat! <g> And, no, they still don't
know why I didn't tolerate it when I had done well on it before following the
FIRST wreck)

Libs

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 9 Nov 2001 00:07:18 -0700
From:    Megan Hull <mistryder@h.......>
Subject: Re: poetic vision and Forever Knight

>FK was a series capable of inspiring thought, a rare and endangered
>species among television shows.

Too true, too true.  And has anyone else noticed that all the really good,
thoughtful, captivating, inspiring shows come out of Canada?!?  (I'm a US
citizen.)
           -Megan

"Eternal nights too short,
How quickly melt away,
With all the love we shared once,
Forever in a day."

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 9 Nov 2001 08:36:36 -0500
From:    Lisa McDavid <mclisa@m.......>
Subject: Admin: Selling, EBAY and FK

I'm going to make an emergency ruling here. In the past I've allowed
announcements that EBAY had a particular FK item on sale.

Now that it's come up again, I think it would be a better idea not to do this.
I'm almost sure that Jean's FK novel attracted attention from Sony because there
is or was a mole on the list. Forkni-l has never had any trouble with TPTB and
we don't want to risk it.

So from now on, please don't specify what's for sale elsewhere unless you know
for a fact it's licensed by Sony. Just say that we might like to look at a site
or EBAY or whatever. I don't think that can get us into trouble.

As for permission to advertise sales, which needs Don or my permission anyway,
that's normally reserved for cases where the profits go to charity in connection
with FK. Note that items sold by cast fan clubs are considered connected.

Tape dubbing needs to be arranged off list. It's ok to ask people to contact you
off list. Just, please, don't mention anything to do with money on here.

Thanks,

McLisa, who is beginning to think we need a list lawyer :)
mclisa@m.......

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 9 Nov 2001 06:59:36 -0800
From:    Emily <emilymhanson@y.......>
Subject: YKYBR/WTMFKW...

You know you've been reading/watching too much Forever Knight when
you start reading a novel, and one of the characters is named Gher,
and you wonder how the editor could have possibly missed the typo.
:)

For those who might be wondering, the novel is "The Redemption of
Althalus" by David & Leigh (sp?) Eddings.

=====
Emily M. Hanson
Home page - http://www.starbase-eprime.com
Web Graphics - http://www.galaxyofimages.com

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 9 Nov 2001 10:01:11 -0700
From:    Rose Thatcher <dreamerextrodanar@h.......>
Subject: hallucinations

Opinion time!  I just re-watched "Last Act" last night, and realized that
hallucinations are somewhat common in Nick's life.  Here's the question.  Is
that common fare for a vampire?  Does Jannet get them sometimes?  Is it just
the depression?  Does a Vampire's ghost hang around for a little sometimes?
Ok!  Just wondering!
                        'Rose

Rome was not built by holding committe meetings.  It was done by         all
those who opposed them.

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 9 Nov 2001 12:02:45 -0500
From:    knightfangs <knightfangs@h.......>
Subject: Re: poetic vision and Forever Knight

> Too true, too true.  And has anyone else noticed that all the really good,
> thoughtful, captivating, inspiring shows come out of Canada?!?  (I'm a US
> citizen.)
>            -Megan

Yep, I've noticed that myself.  Guess with the lower costs to produce the shows
and all, more time can be spent on the stories and the writing.

There, that's my $.02 for the day.

Grace
aka knightfangs

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 9 Nov 2001 10:55:06 -0700
From:    Kyer <kyer@p.......>
Subject: Re: hallucinations

----- Original Message -----
From: "Rose Thatcher" <dreamerextrodanar@h.......>> Opinion time!  I just
re-watched "Last Act" last night, and realized that> hallucinations are
somewhat common in Nick's life..

I firmly believe that 98.96683% of the entire third Season was a
hallucination.
(the rest of that is for Vachon/Tracy/Screed so those fans don't gang up on
lil ol' me.)

And somebody was talking about other lists?
Yes, indeed.  I have lurked on a couple of Digimon lists and I can tell you
that even though many of the 'talkers' are 18 and over, the conversations
run towards the crasser side.  Yech.
There is nothing out there quite like our own version of MasterPiece Theatre
on the Net.  Hooray for intellectual (as well as downright silly at times!)
conversation.

:)=
Kyer

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 9 Nov 2001 14:43:27 -0400
From:    T Floyd <tfloyd@n.......>
Subject: Surprise Nigel Bennett sighting

Caught me by surprise:  Nigel Bennet with slicked back longish hair in a
fairly minor role in "Paint Cans" (1994).  Don't work too hard to find it
though, the movie doesn't really make a whole lot of sense frankly.  Makes a
big deal about how it has no dramatic structure or plot by proceeding not to
aggressively have neither.

LapLor
tfloyd@n.......

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 9 Nov 2001 11:22:42 -0800
From:    "K. C. Smith" <tigrlady2u@j.......>
Subject: Re: hallucinations

>  I firmly believe that 98.96683% of the entire third Season was a hallucination.

Yes!  I wholeheartedly agree with this sentiment!  It would explain SO
much... ;)

KC Smith
tigrlady2u@j.......
"I've never met a chocolate I didn't like."

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 9 Nov 2001 16:26:08 -0500
From:    Portia Eins <portia1@m.......>
Subject: Re: hallucinations

Here, here, Fractured One!  I've enjoyed being on other fandom lists or boards,
but nothing matches the scope and insight, the sophistication that this list
sometimes achieves.  I also have to say (though I probably felt differently when
I first joined) that I deeply appreciate the strictures that guide this list and
FKFic -- they keep this list a pleasant place to play! Thanks listmommy and
gardner! <<Waves!!!>> "g"

Portia

Kyer wrote:
even though many of the 'talkers' are 18 and over, the conversations
run towards the crasser side.  Yech.
There is nothing out there quite like our own version of MasterPiece Theatre on
the Net.  Hooray for intellectual (as well as downright silly at times!)
conversation.

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 9 Nov 2001 16:31:40 EST
From:    Judith Lieberman <JudithL21@a.......>
Subject: Re: hallucinations

I always thought that the 3rd season was brought on by Nick having drank
blood from a cow that had mad cow's disease and that Nat had inhaled a lot of
pot from a cadaver that she had cut up.  Just my humble thoughts.  JudyL

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End of FORKNI-L Digest - 8 Nov 2001 to 9 Nov 2001 (#2001-339)
*************************************************************