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Digest - 13 Jun 2000 to 14 Jun 2000 (#2000-172)

Wed, 14 Jun 2000

There are 9 messages totalling 413 lines in this issue.

Topics of the day:

  1. Fan Fic Question (2)
  2. Dead of Night
  3. Beta-reader wanted (2)
  4. Crossovers
  5. Blitz for the Knight Day 3; Easy Steps for Chat
  6. Fwd: Reminder - FK Alumni VCR Alert
  7. Llarian proudly presents...


Date:    Tue, 13 Jun 2000 17:33:41 -0400
From:    urtikit@m.......
Subject: Re: Fan Fic Question

Nancy wrote:
>I know that homosexual relations was referred to as "Greek love," but I
>don't think that was pejorative. (Sparta had an entire regiment of warriers
>who were lovers, who died to the man in defense of that Greek city-state.)

Some stuff I've read indicates the Romans didn't care much
for the Greeks (although if believed degenerate, this
didn't stop Rome from co-opting much of their culture), so it
*could* be considered a pejorative.

For example, Pliny the Elder (1st century AD) complained about
Roman physicians, accusing them of acting like Greeks.
Juvenal (1st-2nd century AD), in his Satires, was rather
more direct in complaining about Greeks.
"Castigas turpia, cum sis inter Socraticos notissima fossa cinaedos?"
(You put down foul practices, when you are the most notorious
of the Socratic reprobates?)

Barbara added:
>The Romans would not have thought a homosexual a "sissy" or a
>"wimp".  Those are modern terms.  In fact the term"homosexual" is a
>relatively modern term.

I have seen this reference, however:
"magna inter molles concordia."
(Effeminate men have great accord amongst themselves.)
I think that's Juvenal, too (Satires).

But I'm no historian, so make of it what you will.



Date:    Fri, 13 Jun 1980 16:22:23 -0600
From:    Angela Gottfred <agottfre@t.......>
Subject: Re: Dead of Night

No, we don't have a 5th amendment in Canada, but many Canadians are unaware
of that. "Take the 5th" is an American expression which is used &
understood by Canadians.
And, as I recall from my Social Studies class waaaay too many years ago, if
you are on the witness stand in Canada and asked a question which might
incriminate you, you tell the judge that your response might be
incriminating. She then compels you to answer, but she also tells the
prosecutor and jury to ignore the incriminating implications.  That's the
theory, anyhow.

Your humble & obedient servant,
Angela Gottfred


Date:    Tue, 13 Jun 2000 19:32:36 -0400
From:    Mary Combs <mcombs@e.......>
Subject: Re: Fan Fic Question

Muldy Sculler wrote:
> The Romans would not have thought a homosexual a "sissy" or a
> "wimp".  Those are modern terms.

According to A History of Private Life, volume 1 (Georges Duby et al.)
in Lucius' time, "keeping a boy for sexual purposes was a minor sin for
a man of quality." But "boy" is the key word here. A jealous wife heaved
a sigh of relief, they say, when the object of her husband's affections
started showing signs of a mustache. That instantly put the favorite
off-limits. His sex was no longer ambiguous, and it was completely
unacceptable for him to continue to in a physically intimate
relationship. "Some masters even kept their 'pets' after they stopped
growing, but such behavior was considered reprehensible."

To be a male was to be active and dominant. The "two supreme forms of
infamy" for a man were giving pleasure to a woman in a now-commonplace
way that the Romans saw as "servile and weak" and allowing oneself to be
the passive partner in an act of intimacy with another man. (On the
list, I can't be quite as specific about these two acts as the book is.)
A lot worse than the sentiments expressed by "sissy" or "wimp."

The authors point out that a known homosexual relationship between grown
men would have made the (supposed) subservient partner an object of
horror and the dominant partner ridiculous, the butt of *laughter.*

On the general subject of passion, the authors note:
"It is widely but mistakenly believed that antiquity was a Garden of
Eden from which repression was banished, Christianity having yet to
insinuate the worm of sin into the forbidden fruit. Actually, the pagans
were paralyzed by prohibitions."

They note some very strict "taboos" that seem bizarre today: Never make
love in the daytime (except on your wedding day). Always darken the
room. Never completely undress the woman.(A prostitute would keep her
breasts covered.)

The concept of mutual pleasure was obviously missing. "Amorous passion,
the Roman's believed, was particularly to be feared because it could
make a free man the slave of a woman." Not to say that it didn't happen,
of course, but such "moral slavery" was something to keep very, very

LC probably had a lot more fun during the Renaissance.

mcombs@e....... N&Npacker


Date:    Tue, 13 Jun 2000 20:22:43 CDT
From:    "Emily M.Hanson" <emily.m.hanson@u.......>
Subject: Beta-reader wanted

Help, I need a beta-reader!

I'm in the process of writing my next fanfic, and would
like to improve my writing.  I do have a helpful "guinea pig."

I didn't want to post this to the fanfic listserv.

Emily M. Hanson




Date:    Wed, 14 Jun 2000 07:00:56 -0400
From:    Patti Hutchins <engie2@j.......>
Subject: Re: Beta-reader wanted

I'll beta for you if you haven't gotten any other offers.



Date:    Wed, 14 Jun 2000 06:40:55 -0700
From:    tigrlady2u@j.......
Subject: Re: Crossovers

On Tue, 13 Jun 2000 13:52:11 EDT Laci Bailey <TyMurraysGal@a.......>
> Is there any GOOD x-overs? Particularly Forever Knight/Walker, Texas
> Ranger?
> If there are any, please email me at: TyMurraysGal@a.......
> Thanks!
> Laci

 StormyNite wrote a wonderful piece called 'Shades of Change'.  It is the
sequel to her equally awesome story 'The Shadow Dancer'.   'Shades of
Change' is a XOVER with 'Walker, Texas Ranger'.  Stormy did an awesome
job of capturing the characters from both shows.

KC Smith
Nick/Natpacker with Dark Knightie tendencies.
"I've never met a chocolate I didn't like."


Date:    Wed, 14 Jun 2000 11:19:58 +0000
From:    Kristin <kris1228@s.......>
Subject: Blitz for the Knight Day 3; Easy Steps for Chat

It's day 3 of the Feedback Blitz!! Go ahead and e-mail the two powers that
be below asking for what you desire in the Knight (you can also re-use your
letters for this 2 week blitz)...

1. Sci-fi: feedback@w.......

2. Tristar/Sony: http://www.spe.sony.com/spe/help_feedback_index.html

Forget what the blitz is about? Read below:

It looks like these blitzes we have been doing are getting some attention!
So we at KtK, are going to turn them into a monthly routine. This month we
are focusing on the two main powers, Tristar and Sci-fi.

Its going to be a double dose of e-mails from each of you the fans that
would love to not only have FK back on Sci-fi's schedule, but want to make
sure everyone knows that we are want more FK with the original cast in new
episodes and or movies!! So, what do you say? Are you ready to sit down,
take that few minutes and send off two e-mails? It could make all the
difference in the world!

Remember, say a little or say a lot, but say it!! We can make more FK

June 12th, through June 24th, we are asking everyone to blitz both
feedbacks!!! For the two weeks, you can re-use the e-mails you did before,
or write new ones. They can be long, or as short as just saying, "Bring Back
Forever Knight."

ALSO REMEMBER!! Sci-fi will be changing its schedule around in June, and
again in the fall.... lets make sure that we get Forever Knight on!!!

Sci-Fi's E-mail: feedback@w.......

Sony/Tristar Mail Form: http://www.spe.sony.com/spe/help_feedback_index.html

When e-mailing TriStar,(especially) give as much personal info as you
can...rather than just an e-mail name. A bit more personal carries more
weight with TPTB.

I also made a button/banner for the upcoming blitzing, which you can use to
help spread the word, by putting this on your site (you can get off my save
fk page).



Reminder: CHAT with Bonnie Hammer (Sci-fi) June 22nd!:

KtK would love it, if as many of you as possible could participate in this.
More details on how to participate can be found on the sci-fi dominion site:

Or go directly to this site: http://www.scifi.com/chat/chat.faq.html#begin

Now finally is our opportunity to let Sci-fi know exactly what we
want!!!(Lots more FK!) So please, spread the word to any and all lists that
you can, so we all make a
big show of support!!!

**Easy Steps to Get In:

the auditorium chat........
1. Go to SF's webpage (www.scifi.com)
2. Click on "Chat" on the lower left side of the page
3. Click on "Chat Now" at the top of the page
4. Fill in a nickname for yourself and your real first name
5. The default setting is #dominion, so click on that and in the drop down menu
6. pick #auditorium

And that's it!  You're now in the chat room where Bonnie's chat will take
SF chat with Bonnie Hammer coming up on June 22 !!! It's time to on make
her answer questions about our shows!!

Here are the details:

CHAT: Bonnie Hammer, Executive Vice President, General Manager of SCI FI

Thursday, June 22, at 9PM ET

If you've ever wanted to chat with the head of the SCI FI Channel, now's
your chance. Bonnie Hammer, the executive vice president and general manager
of SCI FI, is logging on to talk with you about your favorite shows, the
future of the network, and much more.

Hammer has been instrumental in the growth of SCI FI, including the creation
of the channel's first night of original programming, SCI FI Prime, which
includes the fabulous fan favorite Farscape. She's also responsible for the
development and production of such innovative projects as Steven Spielberg's
upcoming 20-hour miniseries Taken, the epic miniseries Frank Herbert's Dune,
and SCI FI's first-ever psychic-based talk show, hosted by renowned medium
John Edward.

Find out how the SCI FI Channel is getting better and better, and in what
ways the network is expanding the definition of "science fiction."

Connect your IRC software client to events.scifi.com and join channel
#auditorium to participate. Chatters with a java-capable browser may use our
java chat client.


Date:    Wed, 14 Jun 2000 13:13:57 -0500
From:    Carla Martinek <copper6500@y.......>
Subject: Fwd: Reminder - FK Alumni VCR Alert

Hi.  Wanted to be sure that I forwarded this, esp. since the Kung Fu ep with CD
and NB is showing tomorrow.


P.S. - if you want to receive daily reminders of what's on the next day, join
the list on egroups at http://www.onelist.com/community/forkni-l

We would like to remind you of this upcoming event.

FK Alumni VCR Alert

Date: Thursday, June 15, 2000
Time: 7:00PM EDT (GMT-04:00)

Check your local listings for times.

Catherine Disher & Nigel Bennett:
TNT - Kung Fu:TLC "Straitjacket"

John Kapelos:
HBO - Johnny Skidmarks
Encore - The Shadow

Ben Bass:
Starz - Bride of Chucky

David Hemblen (Dr. Vanderwal):
Showtime2 - Defenders:Choice of Evils

Showtime Extreme - Once a Thief: Brother against Brother
Jennifer Dale and Greg Kramer are regulars on this canadian

Community email addresses:
  Post message: forkni-l@o.......
  Subscribe:    forkni-l-subscribe@o.......
  Unsubscribe:  forkni-l-unsubscribe@o.......
  List owner:   forkni-l-owner@o.......

Shortcut URL to this page:


Date:    Wed, 14 Jun 2000 21:12:33 +0200
From:    Llarian <manulanger@t.......>
Subject: Llarian proudly presents...

... her own top level domain!

Llarian's Lair, and with it my fanfiction, a couple FK-.avi (German
language), and images can now be found at


In the near future, I will add more images, and (hopefully) another FK-story
I'm currently writing.

Have fun!

Join the SciFi-Crossover-Webring at:


End of FORKNI-L Digest - 13 Jun 2000 to 14 Jun 2000 (#2000-172)

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Knight graphics and parchment background created by Melissa Snell and may be found at http://historymedren.about.com/