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Digest - 20 Apr 1996

Sat, 20 Apr 1996

There are 16 messages totalling 528 lines in this issue.

Topics of the day:

  1. Oh Captain, My Captain (2)
  2. Mr. Happy needs your help! (2)
  3. Ger's chat
  4. Excuse me
  5. Urs/ (was Tracy and Vachon)
  6. Name That Roman General!
  7. Typist on Ger's chat
  8. Tape tree reminder
  9. It must have been a stunt typist
 10. Roman names/illegitimacy, etc.
 11. Crux Avunculus
 12. Syndie reminder/list family
 13. forgot to add...
 14. FORKNI-L Digest - 19 Apr 1996 to 20 Apr 1996


Date:    Sat, 20 Apr 1996 13:52:41 -0500
From:    Margie Hammet <treeleaf@i.......>
Subject: Re: Oh Captain, My Captain

>Watching Black Budda, you can almost see that Nick has no respect for this guy.
>Its gotten better, but even in NIQ when Reese says to Nick "Did you ever think
>that guys like him (the criminal) are the reason for guys like us?"... Look at
>Nick's reaction- he's like "Huh?  What are you talking about?"

I liked Amanda Cohen too, but I like Reese even better.  I can't say why; it's
just one of those intangible things.  I agree that Nick had some pretty
negative feelings about Reese in Black Buddha. I think those partly were a
result of how Nick himself was feeling.  He had just lost a captain that he
liked, and now here was this new guy.  So I think he judged him more harshly
than he otherwise would have.  I also didn't like the "suck-up" stuff when
I first watched it, but I got to see more of Reese, and there's more to him
than that. All the FK characters have their imperfections; no one is perfectly
good; no one is perfectly evil.

I think Nick did gain respect for Reese after Black Buddha. I just saw
Outside the Lines again, and it probably helped that relationship a lot
that Reese shared the information about Tracy's rogue cop friend with Nick,
and that Reese felt pretty much the same way as Nick about that situation.

In NiQ, I interpreted Nick's reaction as having to do with the "guys like
him" and "guys like us" aspect of it.  Nick had just found out he was a
vampire.  He may have felt he was a "guy like him."

Margie (treeleaf@i.......)


Date:    Sat, 20 Apr 1996 15:06:43 -0400
From:    Frederic Ferland <mrhappy@m.......>
Subject: Mr. Happy needs your help!


Remember I told you that I had written to Prodigy concerning copyrights on
GWD's chat?  Well, I just got a reply and I was told that I would need to
receive permission from everyone involved in the conversation in order to
put it on my page!

I have decided to leave the chat log on my page until tonight, and after
that I'll remove it until I get the required permissions.  That is, if I
ever get them...  So, if you don't have the log yet, get it today!!!

Now, if anyone knows how I can contact Geraint Wyn Davies so that I can get
his permission, please let me know!  I don't suppose he has an email address
:( but I guess a snail-mail address will do.


Frederic Ferland                   |
mrhappy@m.......                    |    Suicidal twin kills
http://mtl.net/solidarite/mrhappy  |              sister by mistake!
NatPacker & Perkulator (!)         |


Date:    Sat, 20 Apr 1996 15:07:48 -0400
From:    Dotti Rhodes <dottir@w.......>
Subject: Re: Ger's chat

At 03:05 PM 4/20/96 -0400, you wrote:

>mean a person of short stature, I have no idea!

ROTFL - Ha-ha!!

>Allison Percy  (sparing you the longer .sig this time!)

Aw, but I like the longer sig - It's your - um -idiom!!

Dotti R
Knightie 4-Ever


Date:    Sat, 20 Apr 1996 13:10:19 -0600
From:    "Teri R. Myers" <trm8203@m.......>
Subject: Re: Oh Captain, My Captain

I am a newbi, big time.  I found this list serve when I was checking out
Vampyres.  So I really don't know what Forever Knight is about. Sorry!  I
would like to know what it is about.  Can someone inform me.  I know that
it might take a lot of time.  But I'm not to busy, so if your not please
let me know.  Thanx

Peace, Love and Bellbottoms!


Date:    Sat, 20 Apr 1996 15:10:53 EDT
From:    TORREY L HARRIS <Dona_Torrey@p.......>
Subject: Excuse me

Ok.....Jamie, Dotti, Diane, Sherri....someone, What happened to the
list when I was gone? I leave for a week or two and walk back into a
list that feels like its' dog died?

I want silly....I need silly....I demand silly! A good debate would be
nice too <G>.

< sniff> I missed you guys....I want you back.

Dona Torrey


Date:    Sat, 20 Apr 1996 15:11:06 -0400
From:    Dotti Rhodes <dottir@w.......>
Subject: Re: Mr. Happy needs your help!

At 03:06 PM 4/20/96 -0400, you wrote:
>Now, if anyone knows how I can contact Geraint Wyn Davies so that I can get
his permission, please let me know!  I don't suppose he has an email address
>:( but I guess a snail-mail address will do.
Might I suggest contacting his fan club president, Rosemary Shad at
rosorge@a....... and asking if she could forward the request to his agent or
whatever? She might be the best opportunity.

Dotti R
Knightie 4-Ever


Date:    Sat, 20 Apr 1996 12:21:12 -0500
From:    Janice Cox <jancox@v.......>
Subject: Re: Urs/ (was Tracy and Vachon)

At 01:48 PM 4/20/96 -0400, Gehirn Karies wrote:
>Janice  wrote:
>> Poor little victim Urs! She's strong, pretty, healthy, and for all purposes
>>immortal. That's not enough, tho, and so she's apparently spent the
>> last hundred years or so bitching about what a miserable life Vachon gave
>Uh....wait a second.....are we discussing FK?  The show about the Angst
>Ridden, guilt overloaded, soul searching, Vampire/Babe/Cop <snip>

>>Babe! Get over it! If (un)life's too much, take a walk in the sun... Or else
>>join Nick in the Mortal Wannabe Club.
>Urs was attempting suicide by offering her blood to Vachon, who was
>valantly trying to rescue her.   In HoD I thought I saw a woman who
>just got a clue into what might be the root of her unhappiness.  And
>I think Nickie saw that too.  The truly interesting tales are ahead for her.

I agree! Urs *could* start to move forward from this point, and I would love
to see it. But another "Gosh I hate my life, but I can't/won't do anything
about it" vampire is one too many, IMHO. Nick fills the bill quite nicely,
as did Louis is Interview. I guess it comes down to the fact that I really
*hate* the whole victim attitude, which Urs has shown a lot. If I were
Vachon, guilt feelings or not, I'd have ditched her years ago.

My original "get a life" to Urs still stands, but I'd love to see her get it
together on the show or in fang fiction.


The Odd Vaquera


Date:    Sat, 20 Apr 1996 12:53:36 -0700
From:    Dianne Therese De Sha <maeve@g.......>
Subject: Re: Name That Roman General!

Allison writes:
> been!  And if there isn't a canon answer, or a good clue from what we've
> seen in the episodes or scripts (for those lucky dogs who have scripts),
> then...
> You get to make one up!  :^)

Ah! The little joys of fanfic :-)

> **** Name That Roman General! ****

Oh cool :-)

> I'll start the ball rolling.  Those who know Latin will have to supply the
> Latin versions of most of these suggestions.  I'm just tossing out some

I don't have a Latin dictionary (and to my amazement, I can't find one
on the web... German-to-Swahili, yes. Latin-to-anything, no! :-)

But I do have 3 years of vaguely-remembered HS Latin and a second-year
textbook with a L-E (only :( glossary in the back... and since no one
with better credentials has stepped forward...

>   - Cross  (Lacroix means "the cross" in French; perhaps he took this
> French name because it resembled his Roman name)


>   - Quid Pro Quo (OK, it's 3 words instead of two and I doubt it's a name,
> but it *is* the man's motto, isn't it??)

um... maybe not...

>   - Uncle  (Come on, Latin scholars -- what's Latin for Uncle??)

um... <flip flip>   "Avunculus"

>   - Q-tip  (What's Latin for Q-tip?  Qus Tipius??)

Uh... _yeah_... I'm sure that's it :-)

>   - fuzzy eyebrows  (As in: "Yes, Sir, General Lucius Fuzzy Eyebrows, Sir")
> sponsors of FK?  I'm thinking that "General Lucius Spamus" has a nice ring to

Um... right... <g>

> And I'd just like to say that if Mr. Bennett is subscribed to this list
> right now I'm going to crawl into a hole and die of embarrassment.  <g>

heh heh heh

> flashbacks as a character called Lucius Spamus or Lucius Qus Tipius,

O.K.... how about "Lucius Crux Avunculus" then?

(and yes, I'm sure it sounds just about as reasonable as
"Mr. Luke Cross Uncle" would in English... but I only know enough
to know it makes no real [historical] sense... not enough to fix it...
Lisa?  Diane E.? :-)

But it _does_ kinda work... I mean, given name "Lucius" (as opposed to
the, what? maybe 7 other choices they had?), of the family "Crux"--
nickname "Avunculus" :-)

> This message brought to you by the Committee to Support On-Topic
> Silliness on FORKNI-L.

Sign me up!

Member, CtSO-TSoFK-L (ugh... how about "CSOTS"?)
Dianne la Mercenaire...   -*-   <cat.goddess@p.......>
-*-"We must be powerful, beautiful, and without regret."-*-


Date:    Sat, 20 Apr 1996 15:58:40 EDT
From:    Lisa McDavid <D020214@u.......>
Subject: Typist on Ger's chat

Just one comment, after seeing the log. I don't think Ger was doing his
own typing, because James Parriott is referred to twice as Jim "Perry."
Imho, someone else was typing from Ger's spoken responses.

There's also a wonderful line:

Q: ... do you have any plans to hit the big screen?

A: (Ger) Only if the big screen does something evil to me!

Cousin Lisa -- "That will be trouble."
Lisa McDavid


Date:    Sat, 20 Apr 1996 15:58:09 -0400
From:    "Nancy M. Duemling" <nancyd@p.......>
Subject: Tape tree reminder

Just a note from your friendly tape tree coordinator:

For those who were providing new eps to those without syndies, don't
forget we start new shows this week!  Check with your partner(s) to
see if they still need FK.  From my local tv guide, it appears that
SciFi is showing the new ep Monday.  If they show them all, your tape
buddy may not need the eps if they are receiving them on cable.

Nancy D., Knightie and DueSer (nancyd@p.......)
   Visit our web site at http://www.msen.com/~duemling/
Nick Knight, Benton Fraser, Ray Vecchio and Brisco County, Jr.
   What is it with me and law abiding guys???


Date:    Sat, 20 Apr 1996 16:03:06 EDT
From:    Lisa McDavid <D020214@u.......>
Subject: It must have been a stunt typist

It must have been a stunt typist. Besides "Perry" for Parriott, I
suspect Ger can spell Duchene. It appears in the log as Dushane.

Cousin Lisa -- "That will be trouble."
Lisa McDavid


Date:    Sat, 20 Apr 1996 16:18:49 -0400
From:    Diane Shea <KerrRaven@a.......>
Subject: Roman names/illegitimacy, etc.

Amy wrote:
>>...where LC speaks to Selene about "your daughter," I have the impression
that not only was Divia illegitimate, her relationship to LC was not public
knowledge, and thus it's unlikely her name reflected LC's...<<

I've got a story on this!  It's in the making.  To some degree I feel it was
both a secret to some, and yet common knowledge to others, given the open way
Lucius acts towards both of them.

>>(I always enjoy your posts, Lisa.  Thanks.)<<

Yeah, I enjoy Lisa's posts too, although they always remind me how very
little I know about anything! :)

Diane E. wrote;
>>According to someone who owns a copy of the script, that wasn't a private
house.  It was a Roman brothel, and Selene was the Madame.<<

I'm certainly glad you confirmed this, as my story might have much less
meaning if it weren't true, although I had figured it was something like that
since Nigel said in a Starlog interview, "They built this astonishing set, a
Roman whorehouse basically,...."  Do you know if in the script they spell
Selene with an "e"?  In the credits of AMPH (I just happened to notice this)
it is spelled Seline, with an "i".  I tend to like Selene better, but I guess
I'll go with the show's spelling.

>>And if he was her Patron, that would explain the bust.  It was, in effect,
a public warning that she was Under His Protection, and you messed with her
or her girls at your peril. <g><<

Excellent!!  That means I'm on track with this story! <g>

--Cousin Diane who, at this very moment, is trying to imagine what it would
have been like living in Pompeii on the eve of its destruction, and trying to
deal with a vampire daughter!


Date:    Sat, 20 Apr 1996 16:24:02 EDT
From:    Lisa McDavid <D020214@u.......>
Subject: Crux Avunculus

Actually, "cross uncle" (and yes, I know that's the noun "cross" and
not the Latin adjective for "cranky") sounds perfect to me.

I mean, poor Uncle Lucien/Lucius has often been very, very cross indeed,
and much of the show has dealt with Nick's attempts to cross Uncle ...

Cousin Lisa -- "That will be trouble."
Lisa McDavid


Date:    Sat, 20 Apr 1996 16:25:33 -0400
From:    Lisa Wolters <MVRJasper@a.......>
Subject: Re: Syndie reminder/list family

Sharon wrote:
>So I'd argue that these satellite groups don't necessarily hurt the
>list--they may actually help it by being stress-reducers of sorts,

Wellll.... <she said, fearing the responses... hmm, is that indicative of the
list? that I never, ever worried before about posting a response, but now I'm
worried about how people will take what I say here??> I agree, to a point.
 All of the various email loops may indeed help the people who are on
them--and that <is> a good thing--but they tend to make me, anyway, fell
really left out. Like I keep imagining that all of this great conversation is
happening *somewhere*, filled with silliness, insight into characters, etc.,
and I'm not privvy to it, because for whatever their reasons, these people
have either decided not to share with the rest of us, or have been made feel
unwelcome on FORKNI.  For me personally, that <increases> my own personal
Stress-O-Meter, meaning that when someone posts that "over on this or that
loop this or that was said," I start to angst. (Trust me, I do it well; I
have perfected in 27 years what it's taken Nick 800 to accomplish!!)  And I
get pouty, and I wish that these folks <would> come on back over and play
here, and let us know what their wonderful imaginations are cooking up, so we
could share in the discussion, debate, and <comeraderie.>

I am glad that the loops are serving their purpose, and that they've become a
wonderful outlet for folks. I just wish we didn't need them, and if I
contributed to the "problem" in any way, I am truly sorry.  Yup, I have
opinions, yup I can be vocal in cyberspace, but I don't <think> I've ever
flamed anyone, and I don't think anyone should have to feel so excluded
 around here that they must leave.

I also need to say that while the factions are a lot of fun, I've noticed
that waaay too many people take them deadly seriously. I do not "define"
myself as a Nick&NatPacker, See-Through Knightie<g>, what have you, and
neither should anyone else here.  Much as we love it, much as we fight for
it, I feel the need right now to stand up and shout that when you get right
down to it, IT IS A TV SHOW, folks.  I am not Faction Member X, I'm Lisa,
with all the clumsy baggage that goes along with that in the real world, and
all the contradictions, etc., etc.  If someone on this list were to do
something to me that bothered/upset me, I would not take it as an affront to
"the honor of Faction X."  I'd like to ask everybody to take a deep breath,
step back, and gain a little perspective on life, both in regards to factions
and email loops.  Hey, there's nothing wrong with a buncha people deciding to
talk privately--that <is> a good, healthy, completely normal thing--but I do
think it's destructive when people leave for other reasons.

Just my .02, worth half a penny on a good day.

Lisa W. * MVRJasper@a.......


Date:    Sat, 20 Apr 1996 16:42:35 -0400
From:    Lisa Wolters <MVRJasper@a.......>
Subject: forgot to add...

Just a brief addendum to my "Jeez, Lisa, get a <life> on a Saturday
afternoon, wouldja?" post:

Just wanted to add to the factions thing that factions have nothing to do
with the real people on this list.  Meaning that, while I personally have not
enjoyed certain new characters as they have been protrayed on the show (now,
*fanfic* is an entirely different matter! Fanfic good; show bad--all imho, of
course), just because my own personal preference may be that I just don't
care for those fictional beings does not in any way mean that I extend those
feelings toward their faction members.

And this is where I think that all of us sometimes take things a leetle beet
too seriously.  So while I may not be overly fond of Tracy or Vachon, for
example (which, again, is just my own thing), that has nothing to do with how
I feel about *the actual people on this list* who are Vaquero/as or
Perkulators.  Or RatPackers, Ursines, Immortal Beloveds, Valentines,
LaCroissants, LaCroix/Nick faction members <well... maybe those guys... ow!
stop hitting!  that <was> a joke!!!!> etc., etc., etc.  :) :) :)

I'll shut up now.  I swear it.

Lisa W. * MVRJasper@a.......


Date:    Sat, 20 Apr 1996 16:38:39 -0400
From:    Jamie Melody Randell <immajer@p.......>
Subject: Re: FORKNI-L Digest - 19 Apr 1996 to 20 Apr 1996

>Also true....thanks Diane.  Now, can we stop please and go back
>to having fun!!??

The Saturday Night Issue has, I think, been adequately covered and buried.
But the underlying situation remains.  There was a substantial amount of
discontent simmering and festering *before* Saturday, and it hasn't gone

Within the limits of the pre-established rules (or any future rules that
Jaye might implement, or that I might bring to Jaye for consideration) it's
up to the people on this list to determine what the list's future will be.
Different people and different groups of people have differing ideas on
that future, and the only way we can actually make any sense of it all is
for everyone to understand (at least somewhat) perspectives that may or may
not agree with their own.

To simply discard the issue without resolving it is to see the issue crop
up again and again, under increasingly more trying circumstances.  Better,
imo, to see if we can't settle things now.

You ever wait on line for tickets to a rock concert?  When there are only
18-20 people clustered by the box office, it's easy to get everyone into a
nice, orderly line, where everyone can enjoy the wait in relative peace and
comfort; with a little attention and maintenance, the line will remain
orderly no matter how many hundreds of people get on it.

But if you wait until there are three hundred people jammed up against the
box office window, it's nearly impossible to create any semblance of order,
and people get stepped on, crushed, lose really neat spiked belts that they
never did get around to replacing... oh, sorry, got lost in a flashback for
a moment there.

KISS is doing a summer reunion tour, y'know... back to topic.

The point is (look!  Jamie has a point!  Right on top of her head...) that
the balance of the list has changed, is changing, will continue to change;
to ignore the change is irresponsible and impossible; to resist the change
is futile and stupid; dealing with the changes is the only way to smooth
over rifts and keep them smoothed over.  That doesn't mean that we have to
spend every moment preoccupied with every little finicky detail of every
post and How It Will Change The Meaning Of Forkni As We Know It.  It does
mean that we need to remain conscious of the issues at hand; and that if
someone has a problem, it should be discussed and dealt with, not shoved
under a rug or derided as trivial.

It also means that each of us needs to take a moment to think before we
post, whether something silly or serious, and consider how that post might
affect others.  Will the post, by its off-topic or 'me-too' nature, put an
unnecessary strain on the listserv without adding to a discussion?  Might
the post, by its content, be phrased in such a way as to unnecessarily
upset other people?

That moment of consideration might make all the difference between
discordant conflict and the odd analogue to harmony that is the normal
timbre of the lists.

Think about it.

Contribution to On-Topic Silliness:  Ribena!  Ribena!  Ribena!


------- Jamie M.R. <immajer@p.......> -------
--------- Assistant Listowner, FORKNI-L ---------
-Illustrated Webgoddess & Keeper of Warm Fuzzies-
------ Ask me about 'Saturday Knight Live'! -----
'We will make Mountain Dew come out of your nose'


End of FORKNI-L Digest - 20 Apr 1996

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